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What are your thoughts on the quote?

AMGT 8 Jan 29
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0

Saying you are offended is just whining (IMHO).

10

I would never go out of my way to needlessly insult someone, but if someone is offended by my irreverence, my sense of humor, my opinions, etc., that's their problem, not mine. I feel about it much the way comedian Steve Hughes described it:

😀 I HAVE THE RIGHT TO BE OFFENDED!!!

Brilliant

This video answers the question beautifully. 🙂

Loved that! 👍

@VictoriaNotes I think they should feel offended; that's a valid response. And I think we, collectively, should be holding our president accountable for his words and actions, first in the midterm election and in the next presidential election — to send a message that unprofessional, unpresidential behavior reflects poorly on us all and we won't tolerate it. But I also think there are bigger issues at stake here beyond offense. DJT exhibited bigotry and racist tendencies, and he is in a position to set policy in regard to how we handle immigration, what our response is to refugees, what our diplomatic relations are with other nations, etc. Whether people are offended by his words honestly isn't the issue for me; it's what the practical result, the danger, is in terms of foreign policy.

My personal view on offense is that if a Christian says something I find offensive, e.g., they're badmouthing atheists in the public square, I have every right to feel offended but I don't have a right to prevent them from speaking, and I shouldn't want to shout them down. Open discourse is a classically liberal position and one that I strongly believe in. I have the same rights they have, of course, and I can use my voice to defend myself and to be critical of their views as appropriate. And they have every right to be offended by my words, but I expect the right to speak openly about it regardless.

@VictoriaNotes I understand and agree with what you're saying — and I don't fully side with Stephen Fry on this topic, even though I lean in his general direction — but I also think that he's talking about something a bit specific and the quote doesn't reflect the context adequately. I've heard him in interviews discuss this topic, and I think he's referring more to people who think others should stop talking whenever someone says, "I'm offended" — not as a way to further discussion but as a way to shut it down. It's the notion that such offense grants special immunity from having to be exposed to contrary ideas. It's the mindset that says, "Rather than protest or boycott a speaker with whom I disagree, or engage them in sincere debate, I'm going to try to bar entry or threaten/perpetrate violence to shut down the event — because I find the speaker's words to be offensive, and I know better than others what they should be allowed to hear."

Though I can't speak for him, of course, I think Stephen Fry would agree that engaging someone in actual conversation when something offensive is said is not whining. He's never struck me as the sort to shy away from discussion or debate, and I've never seen him insult someone or attack them for their views, even if he strongly disagrees. In the example with Amy that you provided, I think it's an "I'm offended by that and here's why" discussion starter, not an attempt to shout down opposing ideas and get the other party to run away with their tail between their legs.

The problem I have with Stephen Fry on this is that he seems so exasperated and unwilling to explain his position in more nuanced terms — he's all brusquerie and bluster, which I think in some sense undermines the point he's trying to make in the first place, even if he thinks it's illustrative. And, I get it: he's outspoken on a number of serious issues, so he hears (far more than I do) the cry of "I'm offended" whenever he speaks on sensitive topics, such as his criticism of religion, and the response he receives is the sort of hostility that's rarely intended to be the starting point for conversation. Still, I wish he'd be a bit less antagonistic on the subject and more eloquent, as he has a gift for expressing ideas beautifully when so inclined.

Oh, I should have been clearer when I spoke of expecting the freedom to speak openly. I didn't mean constitutional freedom. Unfortunately, it's difficult to express succinctly such liberty as part of a classically liberal social contract. Maybe "courtesy" would be a better word for what I meant, though that sounds a little weaker than the guiding principle I think is so important to a respectful society. But I didn't mean legal freedom, just the common decency in society that allows us all to have our say, and then others have the opportunity to rebut or refute. That give and take, to me, is the root of democracy.

7

I agree, an emotional response is not mature communication.

jeffy Level 7 Jan 29, 2018
6

I’ve heard it before, yeah, I agree to some degree. Perhaps even more now. It’d be nice living in a world where everyone has the same values and expectations as the world danced around, but it isn’t realistic. If we in general made sure not to offend anyone, what kind of bland, plain, stagnant world would we exist in?

6

My take is why be an asshole to people so they have to make that statement. Some people piss me off asking questions that shows how screwed up their intellect is. There's always somebody that wants to say I don't care how you feel and if you don't like, it go screw yourself. I'm starting to cut loose these kinds of people.

5

In todays "feel free to give offense to anyone not lily white" climate, it may be the most inoffensive way to register protest, as opposed to keeping silent and thus giving tacit agreement, which i personally cannot do.

4

If someone tells me I have offended them but fails to explain how, I respond with "Congratulations!" That usually puzzles, then offends them more. Lol

4

I agree... It means absolutely nothing without additional dialogue that explains the offense.

3

When someone's being an asshole and they get called out for it, the asshole will get defensive. "I have a right to say what I said." "Yeah, so? You're being an ass, get out."

3

I agree with Stephan Fry, the truth hurts but better an ugly truth than a beautiful lie.

3

My take on it is he doesn't give a damm if he offends anyone, and it's their problem if they are offended. It is troubling to me. It is possible to bring offense, and not have meant to. But does that not also mean that we should examine our own words just to see if we did indeed offend?

3

People might want to read past the the quotation and extrapolate to political correctness in a public sphere and comedians and politicians and talking about it makes it worse or better or whatever, BUT if you take it at face value, he's right, "So fucking what?" Ultimately, he is trying to implicate different contexts, but I'm not gonna... we're not... you guys seen that SNL skit about Aziz Ansari with Will Ferrel at a dinner table...?????

UPDATE: Thought of something else. If I say I'm offended, it's me villainizing the the "prepertrator". But if I say, "This makes me uncomfortable." It's more of a "me" thing. Where are you placing the responsibility? That is all.

love it! it's about responsibility. & i certainly am responsible for my experiences, feelings, sensations.

3

As a generalization it is painting a miniature portrait with a broom. I love Fry, but this statement is far too broad, though I do understand what he tried to say.

2

I agree that has become kind of a meaningless, bullying statement. If you have something to add to it like: "That's offensive. No, there were not very fine people on both sides in Charlottesville.", then it becomes a strong and valid statement. Nothing wrong with standing up, fighting back and being counted when faced with vileness. I always liked Stephen Fry.

2

Perhaps I'm a bit out of the norm but, I know that my sense of humor can sometimes piss people off so, I usually apologize for the offense when it does.

Most humor is based on stereotypical images. I shy away from the obvious ones most of the time but, now and then, I do something that's gender based and it bites me in the ass. Every. Damned. Time.

But, I still do it. Sometimes my attitude is, meh... grow a pair. We're all human and fallible. If I pissed you off, I'm sorry for the feelings that I caused but, if you're sensitive, I'll probably do it again. Gird yourself next time.

Duke Level 8 Jan 30, 2018

@Fanburger [artofmanliness.com]

2

I gurss it would depend on the circumstances ?

@AMGT some people are just naturally offensive

2

I get offended easily. It really does bother me when people say insulting things, chew with their mouth open, or get falling down drunk in public places. It bothers the Hell out of me when someone cuts a line, gets away with a bullying move, or talks during a movie. It upsets me when someone wants some of my time but couldn't be bothered to prepare, or to think through why it is they wanted my time. It even bothers me when people start a sentence with "I don't think ..." (For God's sake, why admit it!)

I like and agree with all of this. And, I'm not sure about your last sentence. What is an example that comes after "I don't think..."?

@BlueWave, lol. Makes no difference. They are starting by admitting they do not think. Hard to make anything following those words sound convincing.

2

i feel offended by it. .... 😀 no, really ...

2

I guess he is offended

😀

1

The main thing I think he is saying is that if you are offended that should not give you power. If you are offended it does not automatically make you right. Personally, I am offended when someone thinks they can scoff at an idea by saying they are offended.

1

You can offend me all day long. I'll still smile, and visualize your head, rotting in the sun, on a pointy stick. You are absolutely right. There is no harm to being offended.

1

I love it!

1

I've been offensive and I've been offended. I didn't care the times I offended because the offended person(s) didn't respect, understand or take into account the tone, reason and most importantly the context of the joke at which they took offense to. And I never expected anyone to care the times I got offended because I am but one drop in the bucket. The world is at our finger tips never have we had the ability to have our voices heard like we have now. That doesn't mean I, you or anyone else ever has to give a hoot about what one is offended by.

1

Context is everything. If the offense is something like what the Big Dorito has said in the past, then offense is warranted. But if someone - say - takes offence to words on someone's tee shirt that identifies them as an atheist, then Fry's words apply, as does the attached meme.

1

If I say I'm offended by child porn . . . I'm going to be told so f*cking what? I'm whining? It's a rather aristocratic view of human beings. We are told to sit back and allow verbal bullies to ride roughshod over us for fear if being labeled whiners or as Fry's character Jeeves would say "not a good sport?" I hope not.

@Dida I agree with you. As others have said, I think with more dialogue, "I'm offended" can take on another tone. Tell me why you are offended, and I am all ears.

Not totally related, but reminds me that years ago, my bible thumping brother, who I love dearly -- was annoyed at a t-shirt I purchased as a joke for my partner. It said on two lines

JESUS
Save me from your followers

I thought it was hilarious. He demanded that I "honor his religion." I told him I would NOT do any such thing. I said "I respect YOU, but I will NOT honor any religion, nor will I make purchases with your religion in mind." He got over it, apparently. 🙂

@Dida Your take is hilarious! I think the shirt was a plea to Jesus to save the wearer from his followers. But, I really like your idea!

New shirt idea "Jesus doesn't really know how to play hide-and-seek does he?" (Or something.) 🙂

1

I love Stephen Fry. And he's absolutely correct.

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