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Isn't it long past time to stop being so understanding of other people's delusional ideas about deities and religious beliefs? I'm not saying some sort of Atheist Crusade or Jihad is in order but why must we keep hearing the rhetoric that everyone's religious beliefs need to be respected and protected?

Surfpirate 9 Nov 10
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18 comments

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1

We are in an abusive relationship. They hold the power, so we have to be careful. However, the wind is at OUR backs, and secularism is gaining ground rapidly. We have to be especially careful because religionists see they are losing. It would be great to double-down on our secularizing efforts, and where we can, we should.

1

I don't evangelize as to atheism, or secular philosophic ideas that I like, but if I'm in conversation and it comes up as to what I think of Christianity (or any other supernatural nonsense) I make clear that I do not think they are harmless. They are nonsense, and so therefore quite harmful to thinking minds to base their lives on them, in my view. I think sometimes folks are taken aback, but I have had enough of these ideas
a) that the supernatural mythology should be taken as fact.
b) that the moral teachings and lessons should be accepted uncritically, or as obvious, or as common-sense, or as proven correct.

kmaz Level 7 Nov 12, 2020
2

I have to live with these people. I will understand, respect, protect or not, depending on what will make things tolerable to interact with them.

1

It would be great to be able to put aside bad ideas. We did it with the old Greek gods. Why can’t we just go one god further? It’s frustrating indeed.

Mvtt Level 7 Nov 10, 2020

Some of us do. I could also throw in the Roman gods, the Norse gods, the various gods of the various tribes of North and South America, the African gods, and the gods of the Dreamtime.

1

Because of the 1st amendment.

3

Remember, they have turned hypocrisy into a virtue!

1

I agree with this fully. They complain and think they are persecuted because their book says they will be persecuted. Put them in countries where they might actually be killed for religion and I would call that persecution.

4

Richard Dawkins in “The God Delusion” delivers an excellent argument on how religion is just another theory, and therefore subject to analysis and critique, and how we do not need to treat religion with any special consideration.

3

If somebody wants to remain in a state of delusion and ends up going to an early grave as a result (think Covid-19, face masks and social distancing) then that is their privilege. However, if the same nutcase seeks to ram his own delusions down other people's throats then I take great exception. This includes the whole of Islamic State and every religious terrorist on the planet.

2

The simple answer is that generally, we're still outnumbered.

But as long as folks do their thing without trying to sell it to me, or get all superior about their "faith" - hell, they can worship a pile of dried out camel penises , and dance and sing and pray all they want !

I think that may so be in the US but not every where. Even in the Islamic countries there are many, many agnostics and atheists they are just keeping quiet because of the repercussions.

2

I don't think understanding is problematic and actually I don't have a problem with anyone's spiritual beliefs so long as they do not infringe on human rights.

2

I tolerate it but I'm not understanding about it

7

I don't respect anyone's religious beliefs.
I tolerate them, because the law says I have to.
In the US, the Constitution guarantees the freedom of citizens to have their religious beliefs.
However, I don't have to acquiesce to their beliefs infringing upon my rights, or anyone else's.
That seems to be a concept far too many believers fail to grasp.
It's well past time that they were reminded of that fact.

7

It seems it is time to re-assert our secularity. Suggest we rescind Citizens United, remove all govt references to “god” , start taxing all religions, punish any that are political,
Hmmm...what am I missing?

The power to affect those changes, unfortunately.

@LovinLarge Ah BUT, IF we all united as ONE voice world-wide, and by the way there are approx. 1.2 billion Atheist, Agnostics and Nones inhabiting this planet atm, We could actually start the ball rolling.
aren't you U.S. Atheists, etc, getting sick to the gills of having the Leader of your country ALWAYS being chosen/elected from the Religious affiliates?
Why NOT stand up and be counted rather than just being the eternal key-board warriors.
I am NOT advocating for violence in any shape nor form, BUT we have all seen the the BLM movement, sans violent protests, has achieved recently.
So WHY is getting us organised so akin to 'herding cats'?

@Triphid I am more vocal locally than any other atheist I'm aware of. I've done far more than my share of organizing things and those days are behind me. As I commented, the power to affect those changes is not currently in place and I added the word "unfortunately" because I wish that it was. I am not in the position to organize a local, national or international effort in this regard. Perhaps you could do it.

@LovinLarge And, imo, the ' power to affect such changes' may NEVER be in place UNLESS we do something about ourselves.
I know and realize that in the U.S. religioins/religio-tards hold the reins BUT the more our voices are heard world-wide, etc, the lesser their hold becomes eventually.
After all, it ONLY takes a few flakes of snow to start an avalanche does it not?

@Triphid Knock yourself out.

@LovinLarge I have been doing so for the last 4+ decades of my life.
What have you been doing in relation to the situation?

@Triphid I've done all that I can and have been vocal on this issue since junior high school, not that it's any of your business.

You don't get to volunteer other people for anything.

@LovinLarge FYI I WAS NOT volunteering you or ANYONE for that matter I was merely asking.

@Triphid Yes you were. You said that members of this community weren't doing enough, without knowing individual circumstances or efforts.

There are a variety of secular organizations and progress is being made. Each person is the only one qualified to determine their own role in the movement, if any, and I don't appreciate being targeted by you. You can stop or I will block you and I don't care which.

Now now children, great energy and passion, but please direct anger to the real enemy of society - religion

@Canndue You best work on your literacy before calling anyone else "children".

@Canndue Hey, imo, it was @LovinLarge who may have jumped the gun and deemed what I said as 'volunteering' everyone else, including her.
Well, she is 100% WRONG in that assumption.
I have NEVER been one to expect someone else to 'volunteer/be volunteered for any job that I can do myself, for example, in the 1960's I was a student at our local High School, 1 student amongst 1,200+, 6 Grades of Classes with a minimum of 30+ students per class, NO heating in winter, NO Colling in summer and in school designed to take a maximum of 850 students.
Staff, students and parents moaned and complained about the conditions BUT none would do anything.
So, at 16 years of age I took up the mantle, begged a few Teachers to supply me with information, facts and data then set about starting a Media Campaign to TRY and force our State Government into doing something.
I wrote and sent lengthy letters to every Newspaper, Radio and Television across the country, was investigated by the Police, Government Departments and A.S.I.O. for months on end, threatened with Expulsion UNTIL suddenly EVERY Student in the School joined in the Cause.
Then we had 'Rolling Stoppages' of Classes, Protests Marches through the streets of town and even even sit-ins as well.
^ months later it was Officially announced by the State Government that " They had decided to select and start preparing a site for the building of a Second High School here in Broken Hill," the High School is called Willyama High School btw.
Moral of the story, " Do not sit around WAITING for something to be DONE, GET up and make it happen."

@Triphid that’s awesome. Your skills and tenacity can be instrumental in mentoring the next generation

, @LovinLarge I can always work on literacy, never claimed to be an intellectual, no offense, just trying to stop a needless spat...✌🏼

@Canndue And that, my friend IS just one example of my many 'battles' fought for others and NOT myself.

@Canndue Name-calling is not appropriate. I will continue to defend myself when attacked as I see fit and have done so in this case by blocking him.

4

Yes I agree all beliefs should be respected. But unfortunately there are those who just want everyone to pray, talk, live, act just like them while thinking their beliefs are the only “Real Ones”.

I disagree that all beliefs should be respected. I respect a person's right to have their beliefs, but I simply cannot respect certain beliefs. I love my family members, but I have nothing but disdain for many of their beliefs.

@Joanne I agree with you 110% BUT, imo, RESPECT is NOT a Given, IT MUST be earned first and religion/religious beliefs have done absolutely ZERO towards earning ANY respect, not even an iota.

@Joanne I must agree with you. I draw the line at beliefs that hurt people or try to control or affect others who do not share those beliefs. I feel indoctrination of children falls under harm .

So, would you show respect for some Fundie Muslim Jihadist who literally threatens you with DEATH IF you do not convert?

1

Because for us to retain the right to determine our own views, we have to afford others the same. That doesn't keep us from challenging them and educating them on the facts. Even though historically that has proven risky, it seems to be the best way to bring change. That change is occurring, likely in direct proportion to how active the atheist movement is.

3

Religion ... pure and faultless is this: to help widows and orphans in need and avoiding worldly corruption. James 1:27

Who ever thinks that helping widows and orphans while avoiding worldly corruption need to not be respected must not of been an orphan, must not expect to be a widow in need and must enjoy involvement into worldly corruption.

Word Level 8 Nov 10, 2020

The religious need to stop milking widows of a tithe and molesting orphans before anyone is going to buy into that pious horse pucky.

@Surfpirate tithe is precursor to taxes. If you pay taxes you are still supporting that type of religious organization. Religion as you know it is a form of government. But, you most likely do not understand it as a form of government but it is biblical text that explains capitalism slavery.

that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark or the name of the beast or the number of his name. Rev. 13:17

Establishment of the mark of the beast 666, is about identification for taxation and government control. Must have Identification for capitalism translation, it is a "religious" mandate.

@Word I've never been a widow. Churches would disappear from the planet and the human race would be just fine. There are secular charities that do more good than all faith based ones. Fuck God and religion. I don't want anything from them. Years ago I was on the street, I never went to the mission. Fuck them.

@barjoe click here: "A friend in need is a friend indeed"

This group was initially established to assist me when I was on the streets a couple months ago. I had been working for a catholic homeless shelter that fired me because I treated the homeless people too good. "A friend in need is a friend indeed"

@Word I hope your doing better.

@barjoe yes and no. Off street but not gotten anywhere or anything else going yet.

3

I've never been understanding. I dismiss everything they say in its entirety. No crusade just ignore Apatheism. They're like junk mail. I delete them.

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