You mean the deporter in chief Obama, who took office with 2 wars and left with 7. Yeah, those good old days when he let the insurance companies write the healthcare bill. He won by pretending he was a progressive, Trump used much of the same message only with hate instead of hope. The people want a progressive but the media won't say they won because of those reasons. Obama won by ending racism and Trump won by bringing it back is their narrative but they miss the real story on purpose.

@JesseBoren yes, Obama was hugely disappointing. In the end, little will remain of his legacy. Mr Biden is a memory, not a promise.

@David1955 I personally will never vote for a lesser of 2 evils again even if it means Trump wins. I'm done being manipulated that way, it only screws us in the end. That's how we ended up with 2 right winged parties.

Lumping Bernie in there is very puzzling because he has alienated the entire establishment because he has been calling them on their BS since he took office in Congress. You should objectively look at his policies instead of listening to the hack jobs that come out every day. There is a reason why both parties are doing all they can to stop him. He has an army behind him that makes him much different than anyone else right now. I don't seem to remember any of those other politicians calling themselves a democratic socialist. Just look at his taxes, name another politician that has come to power and not grown into a multi-millionaire, he had to write a best selling book to make a million while Nancy Pelosi now has over 100 million she didn't have when she came to power. How did she get all that money? Mitch McConnel has over 20 million, I bet they wouldn't like to say how they got so wealthy on a salary of 160,000 a year. They just legalized their corruption, Bernie has fought for us and voted against things like the Iraq war, and the patriot act which almost no one else got right. He is a man and not perfect but he has more morals than anyone else I seen in office..

@JesseBoren I don't like this fact but Bernie is un-electable in the general election. His is a good policy wonk but a bad messenger. He is old, he is Jewish, he looks like an old boring professor and he has a problem with blacks. That is a potent combination of failure from the start. I like his policies but he cannot be elected in America as it is today. He will make a good HHSC secretary.

Look at his fund raising. Most money is coming from young progressive radicals who want to change the world. That is the general thinking of the young generation and it is ok but America is not ready for it. The real signs of electablity is in professional fund raising in PACs where big donors pledge money. They will not bet their money on a wrong horse no matter how much pressure you put on them. Hillary donors are still in shock and are figuring how they do not make that mistake again. They would rather wait it out until 2024.

@Tiramisu That's funny since all the polls show he would have easily beaten Trump and would right now. You mistake the inner workings of the party for his personal failures. He is a threat to the establishment so they are doing all they can to stop and they are distraught they can't. People are listening to him, he has over a million volunteers and is easily the most popular politician in office. Has a problem with blacks, are you kidding he has a 100% rating from the NAACP, he fought and got arrested in the civil rights movement, that's what got him into politics to begin with. He has had a great many influential African Americans to endorse him already so I have no clue where that's coming from. Well, that's not true, it's all the establishment's propaganda since they put out dozens of smear articles every day in all the mainstream media. They paint him as an extreme leftist but in any other western nation, he is a centrist. He may not be the most charismatic person for sure but the people don't care, they want someone that represents them not just the donor class. They will have to do some real work to stop him this time. If they succeed its the end of the democratic party, they will rip it right in two and Trump will win. The good thing is it will create a 3rd party if they do.

@JesseBoren I know that Biden is very good at the trick of gaffes and crash and burn. Have no confidence in Biden. He will crash us all before even the nomination. You do not need a pundit to tell us Biden will not make it.

What you see is all initial enthusiasm. Remember Wesley Clark, Ross Perot, John Edwards, Ralph Nader?

No I know him and he will show him up he is the only one who trump is actually afraid of

@bobwjr I do not think Trump is afraid of Sleepy Joe or Crazy Bernie. Biden has made so many gaffes and gaffe prone that it is just a matter of time that he crashes and burns again. Can we not stop sticking and singing songs of these old, worn out people and begin taking a look at some young promising folks? The media is not just giving enough time to others.

@JesseBoren Spot On- 1st impressions of names makes a difference- should change party affiliation name to Social Democrat instead of Democratic Socialist- dumb shits and uninformed think he is a Communist

That strategy has lost over 1000 seats across this country, he will lose against Trump. The Democratic party has turned their backs on their base so all they have is some angry people and their donors. They will not have enough people to defeat Trump. Bernies supporters will not vote for another corporate sellout. I don't think everyone really understands that most of the people are suffering under the economics, the social issue takes a back seat. That's why Democrats voted for Trump, he is at least putting out a message that speaks to that anger, most people on the left just haven't heard it because they won't listen to his speech so all they hear is the racist crazy shit. If the Democrats take him on without a progressive message they will lose just like they did before. The Republicans have rigged the system, they can not be beaten without an overwhelming surge at the polls. Biden can't do it.

@JesseBoren actually was Hillary but is up to voters our job is to support whoever wins nomination Bernie defectors who didn't vote and others who did the same got trump elected keep that in mind we support whoever wins

@JesseBoren Which "over 1000 seats" are you referring to?

You do realize that Trump LOST the popular vote, and is in office only because of a fluke of the structure of the Electoral Office?

While it's true that some traditional Democrats voted for Trump, it was based on a distaste for Clinton as much as any "message" that Trump put out. His appeal to nativists and the disaffected to blame everything on foreigners, is no different from your appeal to blame everything on "corporate sellouts"; it ignores the complexities of a changing global economy which has moved away from heavy manufacturing into services and information, and away from unskilled labor into a highly educated workforce. There's no going back.
(And by the way; how is Trump not the very definition of a corporate sellout?)

For example, Trump's promise to reinvigorate the coal industry ignores the facts that coal is about the least efficient energy source possible, does enormous damage to the environment both in its mining and its burning, and that there are far better sources which we could be putting our money into developing- which would also provide jobs to former coal industry workers. But they don't want to hear those newfangled notions. Trump appealed to their anger over the changing culture and loss of their identity as coal miners; Clinton told the truth, and lost their votes. Mind you, she could have told the truth in a nicer way, but there was no way to tell them "We're not going all-in on coal" that would have appealed to them anyway, in contrast to Trump's promising them the moon, the stars, and Federal subsidies. Trump is willing to throw the economy and the environment away for votes; Clinton wasn't.

@Paul4747 I don't think I want to sit here and list all the seats that have been flipped over the last decade but it's all public if you want to look them up they lost over 900 state legislators alone, going from controlling 27 states to 13. The Democrats have been relying on a lesser of 2 evil strategy for a long time. The anger on the left has been brewing for a long time just a little delayed from the right wing. The media and the elite want to believe its all over Trump but that ignores the fact it started before Trump was nominated. It's why Bernie drew so much support. The people on this site tend to be more educated and living a much better life than the average person so I'm not surprised so many on here still believe the propaganda coming from the party. Both parties are bought and paid for by the same people, the people that changed the laws and enacted trade agreements that sent those jobs out of this country to benefit the rich. You go ahead and believe it's because of changing economics but the people that have gotten fucked by it will not believe there isn't a big dick in their ass when they see it. Living in that bubble where you believe everything is great except for Trump must be wonderful. The reality driving all the masses on both the left and right will not stop no matter how they rig the election. Everyone knows it's corrupt and the political parties are there to serve only their donors. I never got into a debate over Hillarys polices, The Democrats may be better than the Republicans but only on a very small range of issues. Economically there is no difference, if you support the democratic establishment you are not a liberal, you are a more compassionate conservative is all. The left has been systematically removed from the table. You talk about Hillary winning the popular vote but she isn't the President now is she. That will continue to happen in a corrupt system that can't motivate but a tiny percentage of the people to vote because they know it's pointless. History shows this growing anger on both sides over the same thing will not go away, with every defeat it will only grow stronger. the more it's resisted the more violent it will become because, in the end, the people will win. The greed and power of the top will only speed it up because any system that screws the masses so a small few can live well will never stand forever. It's funny how most politicians are so afraid of it they won't even touch it despite the fact that anyone that does walk right into the office. You think Obama won because he was black? He won in spite of it because he pretended to be a progressive, the same message Trump had only using hate instead of fear. Each of them just tailored it to their audience. Trump didn't win because he was a racist. he won in spite of it because of the message the people are dying for. He at least attacked the trade deals which is enough to win him the office again if the Dems are stupid enough to try the same strategy over again. I think the establishment would rather have Trump in there than a Democrat progressive that's serious about changing things. Trump does make them a whole lot of money without threatening the status quo

@JesseBoren Ah.
Since this is a thread about Trump, your reply gave the impression that the 1000 seats were somehow connected to him (an impression he would be delighted to foster).

I was about to address more of your points, but since I see you're one of those "the entire system is corrupt, both parties are the same and the only way to fix it is to burn it down" people, I realize it's pointless trying to have a rational debate and I tire of you. Good day.

@JesseBorenHillary Clinton did win the popular vote. The problem with the Democrats is not supporting the winner of the democratic nomination. Republicans have always rallied behind the winner, regardless of how imperfect the candidate is.

Good to hear, trump has motivated many in varies ways but he is but a symptom of what's wrong. just getting rid f him doesn't prevent another trump from rising, in fact, if the system doesn't change its a certainty someone worse will come for us. we need millions to become active in the process for much longer than just the next election to demand things change.

@JesseBoren Well, I’m not voting for political reasons, so I’ll probably just vote this one more time & be done with it.

why else would he be supported?

Why are you a whore for Islam and the 52 Sharia governed countries?

@of-the-mountain Which of my comments support that accusation?

he has sold out already, reversed himself on the progressive agenda, not for Medicare for all or the green new deal after meeting with party insiders to create a plan to stop Bernie, just another sellout. ask the poor minorties in south bend how great he is after leveling 1000 of their homes to gentrify it

@JesseBoren shit... evidently I'd not researched him enough. I can't support that action. Guess I'm back to square one for the time being. Just out of curiosity, do you have anyone in favor at this time?

@HockeyGuy Bernie is the only one I trust to not cave in under pressure because of his solid history and his organization is the only one that stands a chance of changing things fundamentally. I like Warrens policies a lot, I like Tulsi as well, there are a number of candidates that look good but if they truly want to pass progressive laws they will have a serious fight on their hands and if they can be bought they will cave. It's way too important to take a chance on someone I don't really know their heart. I think Bernie has proven that more than anyone so he is who I support now. He is going to do things I don't like or agree with, they all do, but I trust he will not cave on core principles.

I love every video of Pete Buttigieg. He is as simple,, honest, straight forward and intelligent as you can get in a candidate. I want him elected but I am fully aware that America is not ready to elect a gay or a Jew or a black candidate.I am sure America will not elect another black president for another 50 years. Obama was good and all the conditions to elect him were just ripe - a perfect storm for republicans in 2008.

@TCorCM ohferpetessake, just like Hillary, and me? Get a grip!

@TCorCM why, because an Estonian troll posted it? You must believe drumpy, and Faux, too.......

@TCorCM Your opinion is noted.