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Racial Identity and Reassignment: How would you feel about it?

Inspired by an earlier post and subsequent discussion, I'm curious to know what you think.

We're all familiar with gender reassignment. What if someone white identified as black, or if someone Asian identified as Caucasian?

Imagine: Procedures and surgeries are available to change skin colour and facial features to transform a person of one race to look like the race with which they identify. Human rights laws will be put in place to protect people in this community.

How do you feel?

Is this any different from someone born male wanting to transition to female?

Caveat: For those claiming there is no such thing as race, as we are all part of the human race - we all get that. Please answer the question, or go answer another one entitled "I don't see colour."

By Athena8
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31 comments

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9

I have financial dysphoria disorder, and I'm looking for funding for my financial reassignment as a millionaire (USD). smile009.gif

cmadler Level 7 July 12, 2018
5

It's cool, I don't care. People will still find ways to be assholes about it, but individuals can do as they please with their own bodies.

5

If we accept gender dysmorphia as something that can be treated then we have to accept body dysmorphia as something that can be treated.

If we are okay with reducing testosterone and preforming surgery to turn man into woman then we should be okay with reducing melanin and preforming surgery to turn black into white.

5

People change their faces all the time these days and I hear skin lightening is big buisiness in some places. I think it's sad in most cases. People should be encouraged by society to be beautiful how they are, but I guess that's not how it is sometimes.

MsAl Level 7 July 12, 2018
4

I am completely satisfied and happy with who I am and also with who you are.

jlynn37 Level 8 July 12, 2018
3

Have you ever read Black Like Me by John Howard Griffin?

mcgeo52 Level 8 July 12, 2018

Taught me the meaning of empathy.

3

My age old rule is to let anyone do whatever you want unless you're hurting someone else. Cultural appropriation is a tricky one though and as a white male I'm not really concerned with minorities trying to be more white other than being boring. I bet other races would feel differently.

2

I think we should get to a point where we don't feel that its necessary to do so. In my humble opinion anything that we would use to define ourselves as another race would simply be cultural in nature.

I don't think changing a skin color would make or define you to a culture/ethnicity/race. Its about living to the experience and feeling most comfortable in that culture. Others should be able to accept you despite your appearance.

Hope this made sense.

cimoore34 Level 6 July 12, 2018

@AmiSue thank you

2

Bah. Too many folks say "race" when they mean culture.

Hicks66 Level 7 July 12, 2018

What do you mean? Would you clarify, please? The post is specifically about race, not culture.

Are you saying people here are misunderstanding?

@Athena Culture is a culmination of expressions, fashion, music, language and art. Race is a superficial happenstance. The immersion into a culture might afford one the ambition of affording all of its trappings including appearance.
Transitioning only muddies the waters by adding another nuance. Say a person wishes to transition racially. Skin tone, eye shape and hair are all modified to the stereotypical consistency of the preferred race. Now you have the start of a new culture that mimics the preferred culture through the lens of a previous culture. A copy of a copy more or less.

@Hicks66

I'm sorry. Based on my question, I wish I understood what you just said, but I don't.

@Athena Put bluntly, this is the most extreme example of Blackface anyone would care to mention.

2

I wouldn’t particularly care since I’m for individual rights that do not depend on immutable characteristics much less ones that people could surgically alter. I identify much more so as an American or a classical liberal than I do as white.

2

Racial reassignment? Really?
That's the most ridiculous thing I've heard today. It is, however, still early.
I understand "gender reassignment", because sometimes, nature gets it wrong.
Racial reassignment is straight-up stupid.

KKGator Level 9 July 12, 2018

Why is correcting body dysmorphia "stupid" but correcting gender dysmorphia "sane"?

Are you saying that nature only gets gender wrong but always gets body right?

Put another way, why is changing your melanin production from high to low in order to go from black to while any different than changing your testosterone production from high to low in order to go from male to female?

Same biology... Same psychology... Same science... But different outcomes? THAT"s ridiculous.

@TheMiddleWay Look, I see them as two entirely different things. I am not going to debate it with you.

2

I find the entire "identity reassignment" movement laughable.

1

I can't wait to see racial reassignment surgeries happening!! We'll probably see an episode of that on Black Mirror soon!

Seriously, though. You're never white enough after a certain point. When you're racist you always need someone to hate.

Example - I watched "The Pianist" recently with my daughter and she commented, "I don't get it. Jews are white..."

"They weren't white enough."

Kintaro Level 6 Mar 19, 2019
1

I used to joke about this. That I wanted a race change. It disturbed people that I would say something like this in front of all kinds of people. What me distuurb someone?

Mooolah Level 8 July 19, 2018
1

I think it's really all about the mental health of the individual.

If someone is suffering because they feel their body is 'wrong' in some way, that needs to be addressed by health professionals. You consult the person, check their health, metabolism, hormone levels etc. You counsel them, you inform them, you educate them about the risks and likely consequences of intervention and what is achievable and if they are sane, aware and consensual you agree with them the best route to proceed. It will depend on how much they are suffering and whether a course of treatment is likely to work. Vox pops on forums don't have much relevance.

Some people suffer from a condition where they feel a limb is not their own - such as a hand or arm - due probably to poorly understood processes in pre-natal development. Having this alien appendage gives them great anguish and they wish to be rid of it. Amputation can release them from this syndrome and they are much happier after the operation. Neglecting for a moment the question of costs, this is clearly the best outcome that could and should currently be offered. I don't see how feelings of gender or race misattributions should be treated any differently. If the person is unwell, you try to make them better. Any other course is either cruelty or neglect.

I shouldn't have to spell out that this is a clinical matter, not one of subjective wishes, but I will before someone grabs the stick by the wrong end.

Gareth Level 7 July 12, 2018
1

I have known a number of people that identified with another 'race'. I say go for it. If you happen to be purple, yet identify yourself as being a blueberry, you have my support.

Holysocks Level 7 July 12, 2018
1

I think the person will suffer more. Suppose a black man is reassigned to be white, I don't think he will be treated well by the racists in either camps. Since others didn't care to begin with, he is at net loss. More importantly, race should not be a major part of your identity at all.

Spongebob Level 7 July 12, 2018

As long as we use visual cues to form an impression of the world, then race will exist I'm afraid. The effect that those visual cues have on ourselves and our society can and do change but our innate human predisposition to see categorize people based on those cues witll not

1

Well, in an age where we, as a species, should be so over racism, I think making changing your racial genetics a thing could add to racism (not sure how, thinking on the fly here), or not. Maybe changing race like you change your clothes would actually help to eliminate it. It's an interesting idea. Personally, I love the fact that there is such great racial diversity. I just hate that anyone thinks one race is "better" or "above" another.

IAMGROOT Level 7 July 12, 2018
1

I don't see a problem with it. It personally seems a bit pointless, but these things aren't about how it seems to me. If it's important to somebody else, then it's important, and not something anybody else should be worrying about.

Salo Level 7 July 12, 2018
0

You might be able to alter your appearance. But not your bone structure.

davknight Level 7 Oct 29, 2019
0

When something goes wrong I have a hard time thinking "why not fix it??"

0

"Is this any different from someone born male wanting to transition to female?" Courius, i was accused of being "trasphobic" for making a statement like that this weekend. I was accused of this because i used the word "wanting" like in this statement. Thier argument was "they ARE a man/woman, - not that they "want" to be." I was accused of being "old" and belonging to an older generation therefore, i just don't know any better. That was as close as i ever been called an "Archie Bunker" in my whole life. Personally, i think they be trippen'.

0

Absurd, unnecessary, not even about vanity but more about mental health

Hiram Level 4 July 12, 2018
0

I could care less about color, gender,beliefs some one has or wants to be. By all means express yourself. Be who, or what ever you like. I'm more interested in the person underneath the label.

But please, stop with the bullshit about my use of pronouns offending you.

I think one of the best examples of this was with Morgan Freeman in an interview about race and such. Morgan, pretty much said, 'I'll stop calling you a white man, if you stop calling me a black man. How about just calling me Morgan. I thought that was brilliant.

Race to describe is an issue. But if someone identifies as “she” but you call them “he” that is no less insulting than you calling me “she”, when I am definitely a “he”

Treat others how THEY WANT to be treated... this includes pronouns.

Have you ever actually met anyone who was offended by your choice of pronouns? If not, it's hardly a real problem is it?

@Gareth actually I have.

@Gareth actually I have.

@Gareth actually I have.

@TristanNuvo You met them three times? (joke)
How did it go? Did they make you uncomfortable or what? It's never even remotely been an issue in my life and I'd like to understand what happened and how you felt about it.

@Gareth Oh well, I'll bite to your trolling.
As to my feelings about using the correct pronowus, it not because I have a problen I have. The problem I have is that some people go through many terms as want to be called. at this point there are about 50 different pronouns, Am some how I'm just to be psysic to know which title they want to be called.

And to be honest I have to elaborate on a few points.

I lived with my sister for a while because we had a great understanding Of being to go back to colledge, and Would help her with raising her kids. And I honestly think I did a great job of it. her son (at the time) got along rather well, we had the same taste in music, movies, games and such. After I moved back in Florida I found that Me (mehew) who decided to refew as a woman. And that made now difference to our relationship. We still have the same tast in movies games, movies and such, but I, because will call him by his, or hers name that she wanst to be called.

I had the same thing with my niece, we also got along with her from when she was about 4, after a while she went from samantha, to Sam. She identifies as a male. and again, for her/him I will call him for what she wants to have to be called.
I honestly love the both of them with all my heart.

My problem about pronouns. To me there are about 50 different pronowns of what they want to be called whatever it may be. and to be honest, I'm not psycic, I have now idea what they want to be called. And for the record, I (as like i made a point to make) is that Ill call my neice by the name I use toward her/ him is to call him Sam..

My problem I have is that there are a bajillion pronouns, and I just can't keep up on the correct pronown. I would rather call them by their name rather than lable them.

@TristanNuvo Well, it sounds like you have coped perfectly well with this problem already. If you're not sure which pronoun to use, you use their name. Nobody has yet asked you to use some weird, made-up term to reference them, and I trust they never will. I have a number of friends in a Buddhist community. Someone I may have known as "Tom" for years will adopt a received name for his spiritual practice and may become something exotic, like "Bhodimitra". Of course it's a struggle to remember, and we may laugh at my memory lapses and garbled mispronunciations but as long as there's tolerance and goodwill, as in your examples, we get by just fine. If someone was an ass about it and I really didn't want to humour them, I would probably just call them "my friend" or similar. I honestly can't see why people make an issue out of this and I'm sorry that you feel people like me are trolling.

@Gareth it is for those of us who it piles onto think of someone flicking your ear, once is irritating, and the more you do it the more it hurts and anyone who goes through that enough is bound to react negatively. The acceptible method in the trans community (which encompasses non-bianary and agender folks) is to just ask someone their pronouns instead of assuming, there are a LOT of pronouns but language is evolving to fit the need of neuance, no one needs to be a mind reader. But ignoring them outright invalidates their sense of self and is generally considered a dick move, even the occasional slipups can have a negative impact on that person's dysphoria.

0

There's identity reassignment I support and others I can't get behind to support. This is in the middle.

What do you not support?
And...
Why don’t you support it?

@Seajay88 at what point does self identification become an actual mental disorder? When we identify as animals? Inanimate objects?

When I was young I believed I was a wolf in a human body. Turned out I had delusions from schizophrenia. Some antipsychs and all better.

Gender identity? Sure I believe most are legitimate. Racial identity? Yeah I'm not too certain. Interspecies? No. That's mental disorder.

@LadyAlyxandrea and at what point is it a disorder? You left a question not an answer.

So long as someone is a cohabitation member of society and does no harm whilst being constructive, I fail to see how that is a disorder.

And yes I understand what the medical definition of mental disorder is. However, a mental disorder does require quite a few check boxes else it’s just a difference to social standards.

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