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Is there such a thing as "cultural theft"?

If you steal something from me, you infringe on my possibility to use my property as I wish. If you steal my car, I can no longer use it. If you steal my intellectual property, for example the song I created, I can no longer make money with that song as I did before.

Most examples of "cultural theft" are just examples of cultural transfer, one culture adopts ideas or practices some other people invented. Did the Maori invent tattoos? Or maybe did their ancestors adopt it from some neighbor tribe long ago? - - When we in the West adopt tattoos or a music style Black people created, the possibility of those who used it before is not infringed. The Maori can still practice their tradition like they did. Black people could still play the Blues like they did, even after white musicians started to adopt this kind of music.

The whole concept that a culture "owns" some idea is rubbish. Do we Germans "own" our words? Did Americans, when they adopted German words like "kindergarten" or "zeitgeist" steal our property? Does not make sense to me.

Matias 8 Aug 22
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35 comments (26 - 35)

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0

No. There is learning from other cultures. There is also cultural subversion.

2

If you take yogurt from the store without paying... yes.

0

I've always said the best ideas are those stolen and are in some way reappropriated but I see your point. I feel like there is a point where culture is kind of stolen from many though, as in the case of dying languages, Native America, or through the Harlem renaissance to name just a smidgen. I find though that culture is most often stolen through the division and restructuring of the spaces in which they developed by outside interests.

I guess I could have put it more clearly that the displacement of communities in which culture developed often takes away the ability to practice it in any meaningful fashion. When people are driven from the living places, places of congregation and socialization they relied upon to really be effectively practiced by things like increased living costs, gentrification, etc.

0

If in the taking, the original possessor loses nothing, then theft is not the correct term. Someone must by definition lose something, for a theft to have happened.

@MereMortal I think my statement is pretty clear.but if you need it explained further..

If I emulate the actions of another, they do not lose the ability to perform those same actions. No theft, nothing has been lost by the emulated, only something gained for the emulator.

If there is no victim, there is no wrong doing. Therefor cultural appropriation (because thats what the OP is talking about) is, ultimately not a thing.

Not to be confused with actual plagiarism, which is theft of intellectual property of an individual, potentially stealing revenue of that property.
That is a separate (although sometimes related) issue.

@MereMortal LMFAO, Im sorry, I wasnt in the app, 'still waiting' is something you say when your response goes unanswered for a prolonged period, unless your goal is to sound like a demanding petulant child, of course.

@MereMortal lmao, You arent equipped for a debate, you don't even understand the question posed.
The fact that you offer no rebuttal, and claim that I am 'ignorant and dismissed' shows how pathatically biased and weak your stance is.

@MereMortal of course to a idiot like yourself, everyone that you don't like is a Nazi. gtfoh. You are a literal joke =D

@MereMortal Oh did they? News to me. But its cute how you can't engage, just throw incendiary rhetoric. You lost the moment you used the term Nazi. It's pathetic, but so funny I can't help laugh.
You are so weak, you need to paint everyone else as a super bad, in the vain attempt that someone -anyone- might care.

@MereMortal Oh the hypocrisy! Im fucking dying here. You must be the product of inbreeding, or meth.

@MereMortal You called me a Nazi, and then complain about my ad hom?! It's fucking gold man.

0

I have often wondered about this but I think its mostly about whether you have the time and money to enter into interminable court cases to get your copyright which you may well not win.

1

I Cant fault this but I want respond so for once I am going brake my cardinal rule and go off topic.

It is not wrong to take, borrow or bastardise, ie make your own, other cultural ideas as long as there is awarenss that you are doing so. Otherwise there are practical implications that could take hold in a detrimental way.

The example that comes to mind is Buddhism and the idea of compassion. Compassion is not a hindu word. It is used as a rough translation for the hindu karuna. But this is where it gets interesting. The word is meaningless even to those who speak the language unless they have expereinced it through transcendence. I didnt understand until I started meditation and even as I right this I still can't resonate with it in the same way.

Language is based on culture. As is beliefs, ideas, etc. I would consider it prudent to take this into consideration when adopting something that is unfamiliar in your own.

0

I watched a documentary once about Native Americans feeling that the New Age community in the South West US were stealing their culture through their use of various Native American ideas and concepts. The New Age individuals saw their use of these ideas as honoring and continuing the tradition of the Native Americans and for the most part were hurt and confused about the reaction from the Native Americans. I erred more on the side of the Native Americans in that they had centuries of tradition behind them were as the New Age community used the these ideas and practices as personal tools for seeking some kind of enlightenment or for personal profit through the publication of books or sale of crystals, dream catchers etc. Cultural theft I think like most of human terminology is a tricky thing and really irrelevant unless concrete proof existence of harm can be proven. Interesting video of an African American woman accusing a white man of cultural theft for wearing dread locks. I find it silly as dreads apparantly originated in India or rather it is their first appearance in art etc. [sfgate.com]

Quarm Level 6 Aug 25, 2018

Many native ceremonies have been appropriated by non-natives when they are not fully understood . Pi have seen it often, where they start teaching the ways when they have no clue . Also, we as a people arw just beginning to heal ourselves, and until 1978 i believe we weee not able to legally practice our ceremonies . So there are reasons have a peaceful night

0

I will give you an example of Cutural Theft: ISLAM!

Explain this, sir, because your remark looks a whole lot like gratuitous racism to me..........how is it different that the cults that sprung up around jeezus, Buddha, etc etc.

@AnneWimsey The critique of culture has nothing to do with the color of a person's skin. It's a very narrow-minded assumption to believe that it necessarily does.

@rcandlish nowhere did I mention "color", I asked you, and am still asking you, to explain your slur based on belief.

@AnneWimsey I'll give you an analogy: why do you think a system of law has developed to protect intellectual property rights? Surely ideas are a common currency and as such the best ideas belong to all?

@rcandlish Still waiting for your explanation of dragging in a religious slur.......
And BTW one of my brothers, an attorney, deals with musical copywright law quite frequently, especially as a songwriter himself.
However, again, why, exactly, did you drag in "islam".....? Why just not man up and admit you are a fomentor of predjudice?

@AnneWimsey Islam is a 6th century religion centered on Jihad, a Holy War raged against all who do not embrace its faith. This is not just metaphorical, but history attests that the threat is real and is not likely to go away just because we wish it to.

The values of Islam are diametrically opposed to those which we, heirs of the Western Enlightenment hold precious.

Why do I assert that Islam was conceived from cultural theft? Well for this we have to go from one storybook to another. The Jewish Torah and the Koran are based upon a common notion, "the inheritance of Abraham's blessing." Though just a fairy story, millions upon millions have perished due to a twist in interpretation. Isaac or Ishmael? The Koran itself is not specific, it just talks of "the holy one." It is the Hadiths that do the damage. The Torah predates the Koran by at least a millennium, its key concept has been appropriated by a hostile group and turned into a savage murderous weapon, not only upon the Jews but upon the whole world.

I would ask you Anne Wimsey, have you ever studied the Koran, the Hadiths or the history of Islamic Conquest to give you a right to claim informed opinion?

@rcandlish and the babble borrowed heavily from the civilizations before it, for example the notion of the Flood, to name just one..so we should similarly condemn it, right?
"Informed opinions" are usually free of racist bias, sorry.

@AnneWimsey I repeat I have shown no racism, but have merely assessed an aspect of culture. You are the one who is falsely accusing!

@rcandlish yessirree

0

I like that we acknowledge that those people did those things themselves - copying seems ot be part of our nature - I have a tattooo very far removed form a Maori one so it isnt the same and i am not copying, I think these thinggs were invented befor copyright laws et so they just are a part of what we can all enjoy about our differences.

0

Cultural theft. Maybe like the great flood before the biblical great flood and the big boat before the Ark. Maybe like "The World's 16 Crucified Saviors" by Kersey Graves. The book is from 1875 but I have a copy. A subtitle is Christianity Before Christ.
Yes, there is such a thing as cultural theft.

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