The funniest thing I ever heard about agnostics is that they believe in Gosh, and fear if they don't then they'll be darned to Heck.

Unbelievable!

It’s more of a question of gnostic atheism vs agnostic atheism. Gnostic simply means someone is absolutely 100% sure about something, agnostic means someone is not entirely sure. There are gnostic atheists just as there are gnostic theists, to that there are agnostic atheists just as there are agnostic theists. All just different sides of a four sided dice.

I agree fuck the labels . . . Why do we do that? I to find the "educating "process arrogant and bogus. I did like the definitions and found them good and without pretension. I must admit I have felt close to ancestors and felt less alone in a cris because I could feel their energy. Even the ones I didn't listen too when they were alive. Dogma is an evolution whose time has come to be put aside. For me that is

I call myself an atheist. I really think that science is the big mystery and that we will never learn the depths of it. If a god showed up tomorrow and he was the god of the Bible, I hope I’d be strong enough to stand up to his terror and refuse to bow my knee. He is not worthy of my worship.

Have you ever wondered why there are so many different religions? Well they start out as unified "all encompassing" , Unitarian etc etc. Then some young buck disagrees with the definition of a word and first a faction join them then it becomes sect , then a completely different church and/or website.
Is this the process happening above? I will start a new topic if this particular post does not draw many responses.

Surely we should be coming together to defeat religion and not splitting hairs . Blanket words Rule!

Agnostic was a term coined by a man named Thomas Huxley, who was Darwin’s Pittbull. When Darwin released the origin of the species, he didn’t want to debate his critics, so he got this guy named Huxley who was a lawyer that loved to debate and fight to do it for him. Huxley used the term Agnostic in order to force his debate opponents to argue the issue itself rather than try to smear him with labels like Atheist, which was quite looked down on back then.

Now as far as Agnostic is concerned, the term “Nostic” means knowledge, it’s how man comes to know things. So the term Agnostic is used by non-believers to allegedly sit on a fence and not commit themselves to being a full blown Atheist, which was the whole reason Huxley used it, to prevent the distraction during his debates with Darwin’s critics.

But here’s my issue, if someone who is Agnostic doesn’t know whether or not there is a god, then by default this person doesn’t believe. They’re not going to attend Sunday mass as a precaution nor are they going to pray every night before going to bed because they’re on the fence… they don’t know if god exists or not. If they’re not going to commit to Atheism while on that fence, they are also not going to commit to the church as well. While I get that they’re trying to act like Switzerland, this is not what they’re doing.

An Agnostic doesn’t believe in god. It doesn’t mean they are rejecting god, it just means there is not enough evidence at this moment to indicate there either is or isn’t a god. Yet to the religious if you are asked “Do you believe in God” and the answer you give is anything accept yes, they consider you a non-believer. That means an Agnostic person is lumped into the same boat as all Atheists because they also at this point do not believe in god.

So why do some non-believers call themselves Agnostic? Probably for the same reason Huxley did so many years ago, to avoid the sigma and hate that goes along with the term Atheist. It’s not as bad today as it was back then, but I can dig why some non-believers like to use that shield and will not judge them for it. Use whatever label makes you feel the most comfortable.

Well said. Let's not submit to the tyranny of the word police.(Or become the word police.)

This was perfectly thought out and summarized the differences well. Great job ??

Ahhh I think I need to smoke more pot to digest all of that...Butttt why all the labels? Im so sick of labels these days everyone has to BE something, Conservative, Liberal, Atheist, Agnostic, christian, Evangelical...Republican, Democrat, Nazi, fascist, fundamentalist, communist, butcher, baker, banker or candlestick maker.

Lets just get rid of all the labels and just BE NICE to one another...

Heres your soap box back, and now Ill take that Joint hah!

I've called myself Agnostic from about age 16. I can't and won't tell anyone that I somehow know that there's no "god". How can I prove that something does not exists? Have I really looked under every single rock? I can only promise that I've seen no proof... and not even any evidence that there is. Yup, very unlikely that such a thing exists, but EXTREMELY likely that man has invented all this to make life easier for some and vastly more profitable for some of them as they live off the believers. I'll beleive what science tells and shows me long before I'll believe the guy who says I just gotta believe the whole load on faith... and cuz he says so! But I live in rural WV where people "believe" and are steeped in it from birth. No sense in discussing it.

Are you absolutely sure this was your 1st real rant??

I would have to agree with your opinions here.

I don't mind having "labels" to help define my beliefs to others. Personally, I'm both Agnostic and Atheist. I don't believe it is knowable whether there is or isn't a god, but I personally believe there isn't. I can no better prove there isn't a god, than anyone can prove there is one.

I sometimes describe myself as a "don't carist" because I simply don't care whether there is or isn't a god. I will live my life the best I can with the social mores and ethics that have been established over time, in the thousands of years since the concept of god/s crept into the minds of humankind.

There are many forms of literature to help form one's character. The bible doesn't help much in our modern society, as a moral compass. Neither Agnostic or Atheist describe how I get my morality and ethics. Humanist is a better label to further define my spiritual/religious beliefs

That is an excellent comparison. Labels are, in my world, merely footnotes to communicate general ideas. Dialog is available for clarification in any particular discourse. One of my favorite quotes on the subject is from Steppenwolf in the song 'Rock me': "...if all this should have a reason we would be the last to know..."

I love your post.

I think there is overlap between the 2 definitions. The first part of each line of each definition is close in meaning.

Definition of atheism
1 a : a lack of belief ... in the existence of a god or any gods

Definition of agnostic
1 : a person who holds the view that any ultimate reality (such as God) is unknown ...

Some atheist rely on the first part of that definition. They simply lack belief. I think this is an acvurate

For me, it depends who is asking me. If its a religious person I say I'm an atheist so they don't think they can sway me with their testimony. It seems everyone else understands that the unknowable is a variable that can't be ruled out however unlikely, and they never ask me to define myself anyway.

Language is so difficult a thing to use . To try to express what you want to mean can be taken rightly or wrongly. 2 +2 = 4 we know that. That is the language of maths, but when trying to debate finding the correct words, knowing one wrong word, even said with good intentions, can lead to disaster. That said language is a beautiful thing, poetry, songs, or even a simple letter to someone is truly wonderful

I often think of a better term ... That takes away the dogma we are opposed to ...

I bet no other primate has this problem,

moves over, shares the soapbox, laughs

I am happy to say atheist until I find convincing proof otherwise. That is technically also agnostic, but not in the believer feels better because I am giving credence to their belief and they can assume I mean their higher power is true.

Nice one ??

That is 100% the way I feel. well 99.9999% anyway. lol

I have to recheck my posts here Keep finding some things left out.