LINK Medical study proves validity of speaking in tongues - The Christian Post
Seriously?
In 2008, the University of Pennsylvania released findings from a medical study proving that the practice of speaking in tongues is sourced by the Holy Spirit. In the study, participants’ brain activity was monitored while they spoke in tongues, giving the medical researchers scientific insight into the parts of the brain active while speaking in these “heavenly tongues”—and the results were astounding.
Bull. Just bull.
21
Enjoy being online again!
Welcome to the community of good people who base their values on evidence and appreciate civil discourse - the social network you will enjoy.Create your free account
59 comments
Feel free to reply to any comment by clicking the "Reply" button.I was concerned that this research comes out of the U of Pennsylvania even though they are siting a 2008 study. The doctor in charge of the study was visiting from The Marcus Institute and Thomas Jefferson Univ. A quick scan of the website for these organizations didn't show a religious bent or affiliation (but mine was hardly a thorough review). Actually, the integrated health approach from The Marcus Institute appeared interesting to me, but again mine wasn't a thorough review, and I am very suspicious after reading HippieChick58's linked article.
I found several bits from the article disturbing in terms of simulating scientific research. An example comes from the openning sentence: "findings from a medical study proving that the practice of speaking in tongues is sourced by the Holy Spirit." The "Holy Spirit" in this case is an assumed entity and not a proven one. Proving anything is source from an unproven entity is impossible to prove making this article false from its initial introduction. Other problems I would believe are serious involve the lack of a clear definition of what constitutes "speaking in tongues" or in "heavenly tongues". How does one differentiate between "heavenly tongues" and someone faking it? Unlike speaking a language such as French or Japanese (as Genessa mentions) we have no standards of any heavenly language and no one can say what constitutes this speak from made up syllables or babbling. Brain scans may detect certain states of brain activity but cannot validate an actual language from nonsense.
I found the interpretation resulting in this statement from the researcher particularly disturbing: "“[The test subject’s] scan showed that the frontal lobe, the part of the brain that controls language, was active when he prayed in English. But for the most part, it fell quiet when he prayed in tongues.”" "Dr. Newberg confirmed this finding saying, “When they are actually engaged in this whole very intense spiritual practice for them, their frontal lobes tend to go down in activity, but I think it’s very consistent with the kind of experience that they have because they say that they are not in charge—it’s the voice of God, the Spirit of God that’s moving through them.”" Why did Dr. Newberg choose to interpret this phemenon as "the voice of God" instead of what would seem a much more like likely explanation that "praying in tongues" is not language - since the language centers of the brain shut down - but randon syllables which may be akin to Buddhist mantras used during meditation sessions. Brain scans of these Buddhists during deep mecitation would make an interesting comparison. Again, however, the concept of God is an assumed quantity with no proven existence. Any conclusion using God would necessarily be based on assumed quantities drawing any conclusion into question - or in other words, it has proven nothing! Snd is highly suspect of being mistaken (to be nice) or on outright fraud.
Finally, why do Christians especially Christian doctors try to mix ancient biblical standards and modern scientific methods? If they want to believe in speaking in tongues, fine. But if they want to really follow the Bible, they should abandon MRI and PET scans, vaccines (no, please don't), etc. and they should revert back to exorcisms, laying on of hands, and whatever other archaic medical practices endorsed in the Bible. Science - Real science - has provided up with the most actual knowledge about our world - how it works and how it doesn't. Religion has more often stood in the way of this progress and has added little if anything at all to the body of knowledge of our world and ourselves.
RussRAB
Level 8
Nov 10, 2019
0
They are making some unfounded claims based on a study that seems reasonable to me. The study says nothing about any Holy Soirit.
@WilliamFleming - I assume you found and read the study. What kind of control group did they have? That is missing in the article.
@RussRAB I didn’t study that. Here’s this though:
“The research appears in the November issue of the journal Psychiatry Research: Neuroimaging.”
@WilliamFleming - Did you intend to attach a link? I don't see one if you did.
@WilliamFleming - I didn't find a link yet to the Psychiatry journal but did find your sciencemag link in your comment below. It does add some detail missing in this article, but Dr. Newberg is quoted in both articles referencing God as a proven entity. Such statements should be seen as indications of tainted research because brain scans show no evidence of anything to do with God, and more often from my reading, explains why the subjects feel as they do, not anything to do with God. This interpretation is an additional leap not warranted by the research.
@RussRAB I didn’t see that but I am surprised such a study would make it into that journal above with the fancy name. Perhaps it is a hoax. I’m going to google.
@WilliamFleming - OK, here in the link I found. The article doesn't say much and doesn't say anything about God other than that speaking in tongues is a part of some believer's religious experience.
[sciencedirect.com]
Here’s where you can download the original study I think. I’ve lost all interest—was just trying to see if it really is in that journal. Multiple sources say yes.
@RussRAB Good, that sounds more like a real scientific study.
@WilliamFleming - I hope I'm not coming across as too big of a jerk. I do have a lot more time to look up some things today than usual.
I have come across religious people who are axious to be able to quote from resear h that appears to support what they believe. While the research may produce some valid and useful results, claiming it somehow proves God or proves a connection to God is a flawed conclusion. Until God can be proven as a valid and distinct identifiable entity, no conclusion using God as an assumed proven entity cannot be acceptable.
@RussRAB I know what you mean, it’s not just religious people though. It’s not uncommon for someone to seize on a study or article and twist it around to suit their purposes. Nice that we have the tools to check things out.
@WilliamFleming - I agree.
I can speak pig Latin, what do I win?
sandrarocks83
Level 7
Nov 10, 2019
6
They found that it DIDN’t activate the speech center. So some schmuck concluded that means they aren’t speaking, God is, rather than concluding that they are spewing GIBBERISH 
A2Jennifer
Level 8
Nov 10, 2019
6
“Please, just please do not insult our intelligence”....would be my response to this (NON) medical study! Proof my arse..if you’ll pardon my crudity...because they might as well have been speaking out of theirs for all the sense this study makes!
Marionville
Level 10
Nov 10, 2019
4
British crudity is so cute. 
@Sticks48 Glad you think so!
So people's brains shut off while they speak in tongues?
No wonder that churches like it. Lol.
From the article:
Newberg shares the heart of his study:
...“[The test subject’s] scan showed that the frontal lobe, the part of the brain that controls language, was active when he prayed in English. But for the most part, it fell quiet when he prayed in tongues.”
.
For an anecdotal take, here is a funny video I saw recently of a preacher interrupted by his phone while practicing his patter.
[dailymail.co.uk]
RichCC
Level 8
Nov 10, 2019
3
Yeah, well, unless they are in a room full of people who speak different languages and everyone understands their babble in their own language, I am going to say it does not meet the biblical standard of speaking in tongues--and that just aint gonna happen!
Joanne
Level 7
Nov 10, 2019
5
Among Mormons (early Mormons in particular) the spiritual gift of speaking in tongues was separate ftom the gift of interpreting those who speak in tongues. One account I once read involved a woman who stood up and began speaking in tongues (I have to wonder if she was having a stroke). While this first woman was enunciating, another woman stood up and began "interpreting" into english what the first woman was (supposedly) saying.
Exactly.
@RussRAB in the bible the gift of tongues was given to the first apostles so that they could go out and teach what Jesus taught them, it enabled them to speak to people of all cultures without learning the languages- no translating required.
So perhaps this generic babbling started in the Mormon church? I experienced in Country Victoria in Australia.
@girlwithsmiles - I've never experienced anyone speaking in tongues first hand. There was a young teenager who came to a televangelist's micrhone on TV while I was scanning channels one day. He spoke plenty of "thou's", "thee's", and the like interspersed with unrecognizable syllables. Everyone on the TV was impressed; I kept scanning channels. I guess I just didn't have the right spirit of God.
Nothing much was terribly original in Mormonism unless you want to count Joseph Smith's wild imagings. Even the temple endowment ceremony was so much like the masonic ritual (Smith was a Mason who was initiated into the upper ranks because he could swell the Illinois membership of Masons significantly, like doubling it at least).
So after 11 years has anybody replicated this? I think not. Misfiring synapses maybe. Show me the results of studies that confirm this finding reproduced by others in the field.
oldFloyd
Level 8
Nov 10, 2019
4
Oh shundo la la la la rectuminia! Hee cummina doodle niya!!! Bullshitius na na na huyundai!!
Ok...I see how it works!!
PhillipSEE
Level 6
Nov 12, 2019
3
Gabucky
noge ablek dilk nilie goobl runr akle lyti bid lieng
ugly
Level 7
Nov 11, 2019
4
Ayp!
Sure, the brain is fluttering with activity - so????? Not any proof of god, etc, more likely the act of an active brain
Beowulfsfriend
Level 9
Nov 10, 2019
1
@MichaelSpinler ooooooh, good one!
Ohferpetessake.......i believe simply speaking lights up parts of the brain. I know for a Fact I can scare the bejesus out of my doctor by doing a stand up routine in his office and raising my blood pressure from 140/90 to 325/189 in about 2 minutes, speaking English. I didn't stroke out, so it Must have been a miracle. He won't let me do it anymore.........
Source, The Christian Post......ooookkkaaaayyyyyyyyyyy
AnneWimsey
Level 9
Nov 10, 2019
3
I went to a church where they claimed to speak in tongues once, in the bible it was a universal language, which people of any nation could understand; in this church it sounded like absolute gobbledygook which I couldn’t even understand. I say speaking in tongues is sourced from bs fed into by a brainwashed church. (And I’m normally pretty subdued about these things!)
girlwithsmiles
Level 8
Nov 10, 2019
4
The most telling part was going to the actual research paper abstract "This study also showed a number of other changes in the brain, including those areas involved in emotions and establishing our sense of self.” In other words while the language area decreased in activity the emotion and self importance areas increased. Similar to when you get into an argument and get so emotional that you sputter when you are trying to say something.
glennlab
Level 10
Nov 10, 2019
3
Tell that to Dan Barker, co-president of FFRF. He was once a pentecostal minister and knows all about this BS. Maybe it's like when we were kids and came up with gibberish pretending to speak another language. I'll bet research could show how our brain waves changed then. Religious groups are always trying to gain some validity by attaching some sort of scientific research. Funny thing, they continue to criticize the validity of science when it doesn't go with their ideas like creationism.
JackPedigo
Level 9
Nov 10, 2019
3
As a twin I do know twins come up with their own 'language'. Mother broke us of using it and we do not have any memory that we can recall of it. When my twin was working at the GM plant in Trenton, NJ there was a set of twins working there that still used their twin talk so making up a language is not so usual but claiming it's from God? Meh, don't think so.
@silverotter11 But did you understand one another or was it a matter of body language??
@JackPedigo According to my mom we did understand each other, which is probably what drove her to make us stop using our language. It's a long tale of divide and conquer which was her approach to child rearing. I've mentioned b4 we are identical-same egg and all but man our thinking is polar opposite. She is a gop voter, trumpette and church going believer. We do not have long conversations. The twins she worked with clearly understood each other.
@silverotter11 She probably says the same things about you - liberal hippy freak. lol Remember, you are sort of in her turf. Do you guys (I won't go down that road again with you) dress alike and like the same foods.
@JackPedigo We do have very similar taste in style but not color. Hard to know on a regular basis she lives in eastern Pennsylvania.
I’m trying to understand why God need an intercessor who speaks in a language that no one knows to speaks to us. Since he is god why doesn’t he just call us up on our cellphone and tell us what we need to hear in English himself
abyers1970
Level 7
Nov 10, 2019
4
I’ve asked my hyper-religious mother that same question several times.
She’s still working out her response.
@Haemish1 They will use the “God uses the foolish things of this world to confound the wise men” argument. I was former Christian so I know the canned responses
they have studies to prove almost anything ten a week on morning shows
whiskywoman
Level 8
Nov 10, 2019
3
With so many Christion Universities, they can generate slll sorts of self fulfilling research the want under the guise of University prestige. Nearly all of it is a farce.
Bluga Shimisso Gexadowee Fazavobicur!
BestWithoutGods
Level 8
Nov 10, 2019
2
Huh?!?
@RussRAB The spirit made me type in tongues.
@BestWithoutGods - I guess the spirit didn't allow me to read in tongues. 
I had the same immediate thoughts, HippieC....but then took a moment. What the U of P has documented is only that, under hallucinations, different parts of our brains can be monitored. I'm wondering if they're the same parts which contribute to epileptic seizures?
LucyLoohoo
Level 9
Nov 10, 2019
3
i speak in tongues, myself: english, my native tongue; japanese and french to an extent; sporadic phrases in a few other tongues, and of course, feline and baby talk, both for use with pets. i rant but i do not babble. christian post, eh? feh! your assessment is correct, albeit insulting to honest cow-daddies.
g
genessa
Level 8
Nov 10, 2019
3
I have given this a little more thought and I have a question. Can I use speaking in tongues as a foreign language for college credit? If so then I can complete my degree.
dalefvictor
Level 8
Nov 14, 2019
2
Enjoy being online again!
Welcome to the community of good people who base their values on evidence and appreciate civil discourse - the social network you will enjoy.Create your free account
Share this post
Categories
Agnostic does not evaluate or guarantee the accuracy of any content. Read full disclaimer.