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LINK Utah Decriminalizes Polygamy with Near Unanimous Support by Legislators - Daily Citizen

I didn't know this:

Polygamy was a core doctrine of Mormanism. It was only abandoned by the LDS under threat of confiscation of all church property by the federal government. But there is a subculture within the LDS that still follows polygamy. Many in that group think you cannot get to heaven if you don't practise polygamy.

It's not the Biblical vision of marriage, is it?

Jetty 7 May 20
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30 comments

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12

The reason it should be illegal is that Historically it has been associated with very poor treatment of woman .

@SeaGreenEyez .Yeah a myth according to who,you ? This information is from a database from 171 countries researched from the woman’s Stats PROJECT and many other articles .I suggest you do some research before making Unsubstantiated claims.

@TheMiddleWay First and foremost polygamy Sanctions and perpetuates gender inequality with co-wives officially and patently subordinated to their husbands .How many articles and how much evidence do you want me to post here ?This is not the only piece of information I have read on this subject .Do the research yourself .People believe what they want to, especially on this site

@SeaGreenEyes. I never said pedophilia was a Mormon thing nor did I say I hate these people .What are you talking about?

12

How many mother in laws can one man stand?

8

Polygamy isn't the sad part. It is child sexual exploitation and manipulation that causes the damage - along with incest in small communities.

Decades ago their young had the highest suicide rate in the USA. Many attributed that to them skipping life, as ‘heaven’ was sold as such a preferable place.. I wonder.

@Varn I have heard a lot of the old men run a lot of the good looking young boys off to make sure their women don't stray.

7

Because nothing says "I am walking in God's footsteps" like COLLECTING FEMALES TO SERVE ME and SERVICE ME...I'm sorry but the Christian Doctrine is really twisted with their obsession with SEX and PEDOPHILIA and their DEGRADATION of WOMEN...SICK FUCKS

6

Well it's still not legal and in a way I support legalization. If it were legal they would have to have laws concerning divorce. That would mean women in abusive relationships would have a better chance of getting out of them.

5

Having been born into a Moron (oops, Mormon) family, and having been brainwashed to become a Moron myself, I am familiar with the church's history of polygamy. Yes, they got the idea of polygamy from the Bible, and made it part of their own doctrine. The Morons gave up polygamy quite a long time ago. However, there were offshoots of the Moron church in Utah that continued, and still continue the practice of polygamy. I am very happy to be free from such a Moronic scam.

4

Interesting. Not wanting any husband myself I may not be the best one to comment but here goes. As long as this is between consenting adults, not child brides who cares? As long as they support their children instead of having them go on welfare, let them do as they wish. But somehow I don't think this was decided as a way to help women. I suppose we will see.

Consenting adults, who cares. Unfortunately a lot of the underground polygamy was arranged marriages of teenage girls to older men, who went from having every aspect of their lives controlled by their father to having every aspect of their lives controlled by their husbands.

4

Back in the 'olden days' men got killed off during the many wars, so it made sense that men would take in multiple wives. It makes no sense these days when 52% of the population are women. It's probably my age but I see little benefit for women having one husband let alone more than one. I wouldn't mind two or three boyfriends as long as they didn't want to move in. You see it is the washing, cleaning,cooking, the looking after, that men my age want and I'm done with that.

4

I have read that polygyny is positively correlated with more warlike societies. Pairing men of high status with multiple women leaves a shortage of women for men of low status. These low-status men are then easier to herd into military endeavors, particularly for purposes of conquest.

Given that, it seems strange to me that the US DOESN'T permit polygyny!

@SeaGreenEyez Interesting. But, are you sure? I mean, what about tax laws? Surely the federal government has some law about how many people, filing taxes as "married" can be in that marriage?

@SeaGreenEyez Interesting, thanks.

4

If somebody wants more than one spouse, let them. They deserve it. I think I would rather shoot myself in the leg with a nail gun while getting a root canal (or something equally gruesome). But what floats my boat, doesn't have to float theirs, as long as all involved parties actually consent.

The nail gun is only a distraction from the root canal!

3

Shiiiiiit... Having a hard enough time finding one person.... I can't imagine having a harem...

That is what I was thinking.

3

It seems clear that the core issue here is more legal / financial / tax related than any moral code. But the financial waters become muddied when multiple partners are involved, and since marriage is a contract first and foremost, the state might become confused!

Ignoring for the moment the history of Utah and the Mormon church, might a more 'liberated' view of polygamy include both polyandry and polygyny? Assuming that there will always be those who seek a more complicated, if not burdensome, existence, if a man may legally have more than one wife, why can't a woman have more than one husband? In fact, perhaps the only just way to reconsider the issue of polygamy in Utah is through the lens of equality of the sexes, assuming of course an age of consent that is nearer 18 than it is to 12--no child brides or bridegrooms!

3

Well hmmmmmmm
Lets see, i been married 4 times, wasn't to successful, 4 at once seems a short path to suicide...lol

3

So my question is come tax time how many dependents can be filed and/or will they be allowed to be married but filing jointly? Seems it might be legal in the state but not as far as the IRS goes.

@SeaGreenEyez According to IRS.gov, your spouse is never considered your dependent.

@SeaGreenEyez Yes, I see.

This is why I hire a tax guy 😁. I know that I am not qualified.

@SeaGreenEyez But what if some of those dependent also work and have an income? Also, what about filing several joint returns?

@AmyTheBruce I once worked for a large accounting firm and the tax lawyers were trained in the art of loopholing. Also, when I worked there a lot of them were mormons [sic]. In fact they started to push the envelope and did a lot of shady deals. PBS Frontline did an expose' and they ended up removing their 'consulting' branch and paid a big fine. In my position I was privy to some of their shady deals.

@SeaGreenEyez A very close friend was once an IRS agent and worked in American Samoa. She was also godfree and really pushed the Johnson amendment on the local churches (American Samoa is full of churches). Groups do fight the IRS and if they are religious they usually get away with it. FFRF sued them in court twice and won both times (again Johnson amendment). The IRS tried to say since they make the rules they can break them. Wrong on both counts. Now with POS in charge it seems they do especially if the client is well heeled.
As far as the client goes a large number of clients for my firm, KPMG Peat Marwick, were wealthy. I had a case of a manager asking me to create records for some fictitious company (colors) and then sub folders for things as Fir, or pine or some other tree company. One case was for the retiring CEO of Nintendo who wanted to find a place to put his millions away from the IRS. The company started issuing 'opinion letters' meaning they gave assurances that the clients investments were, in their opinion, above board and if they were wrong the client needed to only pay regular taxes and no penalty taxes. In the PBS expose' it was shown the company would buy out certain (usually European) utility companies and then rent them back to the utility (this was for cash strapped companies). A streetcar system and even a sewerage company were bought out. The opinion letter, of course, came with a hefty, up front charge. Furthermore, I had to put these records in a closed and sealed room. I once questoned the manager on this. This was a woman who was a friend and we even went to her marriage reception. She got red and walked away. Again, money and power rules.

@SeaGreenEyez Yes it is a sad reality but it has been this way for ages. Sometimes the wealthy do good things but too often they give in to their baser instincts and create misery for others.
These posts and comments really stir up a lot of memories. Many from the good/bad old days at KPMG. Funny when I lived in Germany on the way home from work I went past a building that advertised KPMG Treuhand. Never imagined working for them.

3

The New Testament tends to support one man/one woman, but not too rigorously. The Old Testament allowed multiple wives (but not a woman with multiple husbands. No surprise there in their male-dominated society).

3

If it's made legal there will be laws governing age etc... way better chance of doing good prosecution and for women trying to get out of these entaglements.

Also it'll be a place poly folks can go to co-habitat in peace. Won't that just squick the Mormons?

Many states have clauses that allow parents to give permission to those that are under age to marry, so there might not be enough protection.

@MizJ That's true. I forgot about that - but always hope that laws will prevent harm to minors.

3

Stopping that had also allowed them ‘Statehood.’ Maybe they’re ready to succeed ..then Romney can finally be a President!

An aside (it’s crazy rainy out, so yur stuck with me inside) - Recently, I was considering a move.. And remembered how beautiful a ‘Utah Morning’ had been (if from the inside of a Penske moving truck cab) ...along the western edge of our Rockies… Did some geological research - shit - the Mormons could not have located themselves in a more geologically unstable place ...so they’d better breed quick 😉

Varn Level 8 May 20, 2020
2

Damn....will I have to buy a bigger bed?

2

And where ya gonna go when they are all in a bad mood? They'll hunt you down like a rabbit.

2

I wonder if they include polyandry in these polyamorous rules.🤔

@SeaGreenEyez that is a surprise! In the past that is still taboo when people start the polyamory/polygamy discussion.

2

I do not understand how that works. I could not do this as to many people involved and how you stay alive when a mistake is made. Guess I would be more concerned for the women than others.
Most of my experiences with this have a man that does whatever he wants while all the women work and try to make him happy. I would think this would get old really fast for the women.

2

The separation of church and state doesn't exist in Utah.
It never really has.
They're just really open about it now.

Thats because they have a President who panders his bloated ASS off to the Evangelicals that make up the majority of his base. Without them he has nada...zip...bubkis...squat...jack shot...nothing.

@phoenixone1 What's going on in Utah started long before 45 ever showed up.
The mormons have entrenched themselves in state politics, going back decades.
The evangelicals aren't mormons. They're just as fanatical, but not the same.
Neither faction claims the other.

That said, the lds was founded by a con man.
Like an actual documented, criminal con man.
But the suckers believe it.
Just like all the other believers.

@KKGator
Jack Mormons know how Utah and its selected specially blessed under ware wearing government is!!!

1

The Old Testament of the Christian Bible allows polygamy, but it does not require it. It has been decades since I read The Book of Mormon, but I think it follows the Old Testament in allowing polygamy. However, there also are some verses in the Book of Mormon that say men should have only one wife unless God tells them otherwise.

1

If anyone here has read much (Robert A.) Heinlein, there are some very good arguments for allowing people to make whatever contracts they want with respect to relationships, family, and cohabitation. Of course, contracts require consenting adults. Just as children can be adopted, so can new partners. All contracts. Larger families can be much more stable and enduring, providing a more secure environment to raise children. After all, if every child should have a mother and a father, why not several of each in a broad range of ages/generations? This would be great for socialization and for affording to have some parents, who want to, stay home with the children. I think it's a win-win.

And why is there only one time-frame for marriage, " 'til death do us part"? We should be able to have any length marriage we decide on. When it comes up for renewal, you can ask, "Is this really what I want? Is this relationship right for me, for us?" Far too many people are in marriages because it's too expensive to get out or out of a sense of obligation.

Basically, I think the whole idea of marriage should be a much more flexible, customized, contractual relationship.

@Jetty I agree. Right now the government gives preferential treatment to marriage. No law should discriminate on the basis of marital status. The only legal effects of marriage should be those specifically written into the contract that the members of that union enter into. My belief, of course. The government should not be influencing the types of relationships that consenting adults can in or giving particular types of relationships special treatment or benefits.

1

I've always thought that bigamy would be both a crime and the punishment.

JimG Level 8 May 22, 2020
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