Ideally, you are correct, no tax breaks for either, but trying to get them to start taxing churches is not likely to fly in this century.

@Archeus_Lore Well, here's to hoping. I feel for the ones who both pay taxes and tithes.

It implies nothing of the sort. In fact, my "implication" was that science is superior to religion. They are a long ways from equivalent.

So you want free education. So how are you going to fund it ?

@Moravian end Masonic lodge secret religion racist devil worshipper capitalism slave labor government then make sure everyone has a bank account of a million billion trillion unlimited dollars. Then money, or the lack thereof, would not be an issue for anyone. Funding solved. Free education for everyone.

@Word So you don't have an answer. Thought so.

@Fred_Snerd if you go to my duscussion groups, you can leave ideals in one "Mynd Storm" or make discussion about ending christianity and Masonic lodge secret religion racist devil worshippers being lead by Lucifer the devil, most commonly known as Jesus the Christ. "Illogical atheists guide for ending Christianity "

@Fred_Snerd you say," We can't offer the alternative of a better world until we build one.". There lies the problem, you cannot offer a free life, cannot build a free life, if you do not have freedom to do so. Elite must be eliminated or converted.

@Word and @Moravian... Truly free education exists in the US, it has existed for decades, and taxes is what makes it possible in the US - all the way to PhD level and beyond.

I am living proof of it.

I came here as a child on visa. My parents paid a lot for county state and federal taxes up to 30% in total per year. Even if you don't pay much in taxes you get a free high school education. If you do the hard work you can then earn merit scholarships or govt grants to go to a state college...free college degree. Which is what I did.

If you work hard in college and get good grades you can get BS tech degree, and go directly into a PhD program...for free. For state colleges, the PhD program pays you a monthly stipend AND pays your tuition for completing your PhD. Not only was my education free I got money for rent and food.

At least $160,000 of direct tax payer money was spent to educate house and feed me until I got my PhD. I'm very grateful. Most job in my science PhD pays 90k or above. I'm glad to pay my taxes to give the next generation a chance at a totally free education.

All anyone has to have is the amibition, the will power, the work ethic, the endurance, and the ability to work hard, and not give up. Even if you feel stupid, dumb, unworthy, a fraud, acknowledge those feelings, but then work hard anyways and do your best. Dont ever quit. If you can do that you will succeed. I am proof of it. And anyone can do it.

And I do mean anyone. Since most Americans avoid going to PhD level, and research needs to get done for cheap, that tax payer money goes to foreign national students. Nothing against them, they are all hard workers with ambition.

At small state research (R1) colleges atleast 80% to 90% of most technical masters and PhD programs are likely foriegn nationals. In my years as a PhD, of the almost 100 PhD students I personally interacted with, only 5 were US citizens. I met Indian, Chinese, Korean, Russian, German, Mexican, Italian, Japanese, Nepalese, even Iranian. But not many US citizens. Why? I don't know. The tax funded essentially free science and engineering PhD programs in state colleges are available to literally anyone with a B.S. degree.

I'll say it again taxes makes truly free education available to literally anyone who is willing work hard for it.

@Fred_Snerd Be careful, Atheist agnostic Jim Jones was a Marxist that killed over 900 people in a commune.

@MakeItGood I have been hard worker, above average I.Q., I was told in college to get loans to pay back. Then I was told to get married to get better Grant's. I have bad eye sight. Never has it been offered to me "here is the curriculum and unlimited money so you can learn at the pace your pore eye sight allows so you can learn enjoyably for the sake of enjoying the learning process enjoying yourself with out force. What college I have been able to complete, 4.0 gpa and salutatorian of police academy and no offer of any further free college cree from being forced to fill out applications and begging for money.

@MakeItGood Where is there an educational, knowlledge, invention institute on every street corner in the world so that all people animals can just run down to the local educational institution and get them a nice quick convenient tasty bite of knowledge?

@MakeItGood where on Earth can any animal person freely build themselves an educational institution and be able to then themselves teach people some nice aromatic knowledge freely for any animal people any where on Earth?

@MakeItGood If your education cost $160000 it was hardly free was it?. Not many students are as fortunate as you were.
University tuition fees are genuinely free to the student in Scotland, for Scottish and EU residents only, which would total just under £40000 for the standard four year degree course.
Grants are available for living costs which are paid back from earnings when the student starts working.

@Word what do you mean by poor eyesight? Can you read? I have very bad eyesight myself, i wear very thick glasses. Are you legally blind? Can you drive?
I also have poor attention span, it takes me 10 mins to read a textbook page. I have to read it aloud, and english wasnt my first language. I have a very bad back that prevents me from sitting for long periods. I overcame or endured all of it. I don't want to hear excuses unless you are legally blind, or are physically or mentally incapacitated in a big way that prevents you from doing tasks yourself like talking, driving, bathing, cooking etc.

Loans are only needed if you didnt do well in your high school classes. Even then loans arent too bad if you pick the right career.

IF you have good grades, you get free money. This was obvious to me since the 9th grade. All everyone talks about in movies and TV shows are getting good grades to get scholarships. Get good grades, and you get free money for college. Simple enough. I spent a big part of my high school working hard to get good grades, working till 9 or 10 pm everyday, just so I have my weekends free to learn other things they don't teach in high school. I didnt speak English well, so I watched American TV shows and learned the American accent. I went to city libraries on weekends and could check out all the books I needed for free to learn. I went to city college libraries and read books there for free. I couldn't check them out, but the library is open to public every day including weekends.

You have all the chances to get a free education that everyone else does. You still do. You can now go to your city library and get access to books for free, including online books and audiobooks. You can go to coursera and get college courses for free. Universities now put video of college lectures online for FREE. You can go to mitocw or nptel or whole bunch of college websites to get undergraduate and graduate lectures FOR FREE. you just don't get the degree. Back then I went to used book shops and paid for textbooks. Its only gotten infinitely easier and better to get free education.

Boohoo, oh no you have to spend a few measely hours of a Saturday sitting in a chair and work pen to paper or click the keyboard in the comfort of your home to fill out an easy application and pay a small processing fee which can be easily wavied if you are low income. Give me a break! I filled out my first college application using free internet at the library and printed out the application form for $0.10 a page. I sent it via mail with a money order of $50 with money I made digging holes for fence posts for 4 hours. That was all in a day's work. It even easier now! I can uber for a few hours and make enough money. You are complaining about how hard it is to fill out a simple application form. Fuck off with that whiny attitude! Come back with get-it-done attitude!!

Begging for money!? Only someone who hasnt worked hard thinks that way. It means you think you don't deserve that money. I worked hard for my scholarships. When I filled out those applications, I knew I earned every penny. I earned my education money. I spent years of unpaid hard work I did on my own 12 hours a day 7 days a week that resulted in As and high scores. Earning that scholarship or getting accepted to college means I got paid for my hard work. There was no begging involved.

BTW, IQ means nothing, its not a real measure of intelligence. This is why colleges don't ask for your IQ test, they know its bogus.

Besides intelligence doesn't matter. Intelligence determines how quickly you learn, not whether you can learn. A lot of people are more intelligent than me. They can learn faster than me. But they don't want to learn. So their intelligence is useless to them. They expect things to go easy because learning was easy. And when things tough, the so-called intelligent people quit when they feel stupid or dumb or exhausted. I never had it easy. So I never quit. Doesnt matter if I fail. I will try again. And again. And again. Until I get it. Dont think its supposed to be easy or fun. It onlt becomes fun after the hard work and failure, not before.

@Moravian i didnt pay $160000. It was paid through scholarships and grants funded by taxes.

@MakeItGood when I was younger it was not so bad this is why I needed free college at 6 years old rather than kandygarten where it causes teeth to fall out. my vision has gotten blurry in both eyes with reading glasses it is still blurry difficult to read and very flusterating with eye strain and pain of strain. On good days, especially in the morning I can read better than later in the evening when my eyes are more so tired.

I drive but have to cheat with contacts to get my drivers license with out restrictions.

I have learned speed reading types of techniques where I glance ok ver text, but like your last long text you sent it is too flustera5to bother reading it.

Amblyopia usually develops in early childhood and is the leading cause of vision loss in children. Early vision screening by a pediatrician, family doctor or an ophthalmologist is important in detecting children with amblyopia as young as possible. A number of eye diseases can contribute to the development of amblyopia.

Amblyopia treatment should be started as early as possible because:

over time the amblyopic “lazy” eye could become permanently blind;
depth perception (3-D vision) could be lost; and
if the other, better-seeing, eye becomes diseased or injured, the amblyopic “lazy” eye cannot replace the loss in vision.

@MakeItGood I can take care of my self well enough I most likely get a shower a week. I showered 2 days in a row this week one day before going to E.R. and next day before going to primary care doctor.

All a waste, prescriptions and specialize doctors I need cost money. If free college for everyone then everyone would be a doctor of every kind and every one would get totally free medical from anyone.

@Word did you just say my post was too long to read? It took me a min to read your. Mine should have taken about 3 mins.

So you can see with one eye. So you can read. Whats the problem. So what if the loss of one eye will lead to blindness? Thats whats stopping you? Loss of two eyes will also lead to blindness. That doesnt stop me.

Whats with all the excuses? Education isnt dangerous work. Its sitting in a chair with a laptop or a book. Where's the danger?

@MakeItGood I went back to college classes 9 years ago, while doing English comp and American lit classes I would get nose bleeds and headaches from reading frustration. The danger you ask? Might give myself a stroke

@MakeItGood even thought I had n ok se bleeds and headaches in my least favorite classes I still had a 4.0 and published my first book in 2012.

Greatest book ever. It is a nice short read that explains any thing and everything in just one sentence. Yes, a book with only one sentence and 220 otherwise blank pages. Awesome to read and understand just about everything.

@MakeItGood and that semester I took 24 college credit hours working 3 jobs 60 plus hours a week to make enough money and still maintained a 4.0 gpa

@MakeItGood but after my semester of 3 jobs, 24 college credit hours and 60 plus work hours a week did any say, "you are doing so good we need to prove you and everyone on earth with full ride scholarship so you and everyone on Earth can enjoy a doctors degree of every kind ". No, not a goodie college has done such a thing.

@MakeItGood Good Versus Evil: from beginning to end [amazon.com]

@MakeItGood no need to buy the book the one sentence is "There is good and there is evil."

Get a dictionary and thesaurus and you own spiral note book and learn both of the words. No need to purchase, the information is free you just do the work to learn the knowledge of good and evil.

@MakeItGood once you get the basics of the knowledge of good and evil, try advanced studies contemplating oxymoron, good evil or evil good. I ask, is the oxymoron really good, or really evil?

@MakeItGood what doctor degrees did you get?

@Word why would you take 24 credit hr and 3 jobs? Thats dumb! Either work fulltime or go to school fulltime. Dont half ass 4 jobs. Whole ass 1 job. School is a full time job. If you don't have money, then work first, save up for money for college. Then go to college fulltime, and maybe work one easy part time job. Preferably you can work at the university. I worked for 10 years before I decided to go to grad school. I earned ok money enough to save up to have a safety net for a few years if needed. I choose PhD when I got fired in a down economy and asked Prof. about PhD and he said he has funding and will support me.

Reading does not cause headaches and nosebleed. Go to a doctor and get your health checked. There is ZERO danger in the act of reading if your health is good. Dont read or go to school if your health is actively bad. Focus on getting it good.

4.0 is largely meaningless without knowing what courses you took. If you took intro to quantum physics and got 4.0 thats more impressive that taking intro to art. I never rely on grades to tell me if someone knows their stuff. GPA is for departmental use only to assess your progress and skill abilities within thier specific program.

Publishing a book means nothing. Tell me that your book has won a presitigious award or on a bestseller list or is being analyzed by expert critics or being taught in classes - then I'll be impressed. Anyone can pay to publish anything on Amazon Kindle.

i don't like to use the words good vs evil. Those are religious ideas and leads to harmful thoughts. I prefer beneficial vs harmful actions and thoughts.

I have a PhD in Material Science.

@MakeItGood good and evil Is not specifically religious terms, they are in dictionary.

@MakeItGood knowledge of good and evil is the basis for logic, so you cannot avoid the knowledge of Good and evil when dealing with science that uses logic

@MakeItGood I know having a certificate being educated doesn't exact certify that you are all that smart. Benefit is synonymous with good, harmful synonymous with evil. Study the dictionary and thesaurus as I already suggested. Even more so, used several different dictionary and thesaurus sources. Write them down making a conceptual tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

@MakeItGood wheither business ethics or morals, both being synonymous, they are based on the knowledge of good and evil.

late Middle English (denoting ethics or moral philosophy; also used attributively): from Old French éthique, from Latin ethice, from Greek (hē) ēthikē (tekhnē) ‘(the science of) morals’, based on ēthos (see ethos).

Moral - concerned with the principles of right and wrong behavior and the GOODness or BADness [evil] of human character.

Quality is about a measure of goodness as in good, better and best. Qualitative. And evil, if you studied your assignment, is an antonym, opposite, to good.

There is not much that is not touched by the knowledge of good and evil.

@MakeItGood if you want to study good and evil for drama purposes, there is "good" guy Protagonist and the bad[evil] guy antagonist.

Even in God damn drama cannot get away from knowledge of good and evil.

@MakeItGood you said, "i don't like to use the words good vs evil. Those are religious ideas and leads to harmful thoughts."

Religion ... pure and faultless is this: to help widows and orphans in need and avoiding worldly corruption. James 1:27

How is knowledge of good and evil harmful to widows and orphans while avoiding worldly corruption?

Or, What flavor of religion are you talking about and why would you call it religion?

@MakeItGood I am open to consider a GOOD reason why the knowledge of good and evil should NOT be learned or taught. Please feel free to review a few dictionaries and thesauruses then explain to me with and/or without using a "good" reason why it should not.

And, why are you "makeitgood" if you are anti-religious of sorts?

@MakeItGood Yes I aware of that but to imply that this is the norm is very misleading. I have a young friend who attended Rhode Island art school at a cost of around $50,000 pa. Fortunately his parents could use inherited money to pay for much of the cost or he would have been lumbered with massive debts.

@MakeItGood, @Word There is no such thing as "evil". It is a religious invention.
Science is neither good or bad it just is. It is the application of science that can be good or bad.
Science gave us nuclear weapons and some people would argue that they are good because they stopped the Soviet Union and the West fighting a conventional war.

@Moravian There is good and there is evil. Evil is opposite to good. The words are used as adjectives - a word or phrase naming an attribute, added to or grammatically related to a noun to modify or describe it.

Evil does not exist? Are you saying modifying and describing does not exist?

@Moravian bad and evil are synonym.

Old English yfel (Kentish evel) "bad, vicious, ill, wicked," from Proto-Germanic ubilaz (source also of Old Saxon ubil, Old Frisian and Middle Dutch evel, Dutch euvel, Old High German ubil, German übel, Gothic ubils), from PIE upelo-, from root *wap- "bad, evil" (source also of Hittite huwapp- "evil" ).

As a noun. Are you saying nothing causes injure?

"anything that causes injury, anything that harms or is likely to harm; a malady or disease; conduct contrary to standards of morals or righteousness," Old English yfel (see evil (adj.)).

@Word Well, since the word is listed in my trusty Collins dictionary I will have to accept that it is in current usage but I will only accept it as an adjective not as a noun. If you ever see an evil let me know.

As soon as religion gives ANY opinion of anything political, they have just forfeited their tax exemption. Period. Never have I seen an argument that can counter my statement.

@BlizzardMan politics is many blood sucking parasites. Poly means many. Ticks are blood sucking parasites. Poly-ticks many blood sucking parasites. No one needs politics.

@Fred_Snerd United States of America is an invasionary secret religion government that needs eradication.