@mzbehavin I'm sure he understands from the part of the perpetrator, the one with the power. I wonder how he would feel if he himself was a victim of an act like this.

@TomGiverin It's always about money and class.

@GinaKay Yes it is and always has been. We have one justice system for the rich and another for everyone else. I'll believe otherwise as soon prisons have a fitting % of rich folks.

@TomMcGiverin Precisely.

@273kelvin NO! We are changing this culture so our justice system protects all victims and prosecutes all perpetrators. To think otherwise means women don't really have a voice in this democracy.

@maturin1919 Please don't do us any favors.

@GinaKay There is a difference between the personal and the societal. In terms of society you are of course 100% right. However given the legal difficulties of rape cases, even a good case with a strong, efficient, and dedicated prosecution. Often it will come down to "He said she said" which always allows the benefit of doubt to swing towards the defence. That is in a good case, many are not. Time may have elapsed, evidence lost, sometimes by the prosecution itself (I have known this happen). So on a personal level if I were to advise any woman close to me how to proceed? I would go with thugs. The chances of getting justice legally are too small.
It is rather like bullying. Whist we all condemn this and would want schools to act to stamp it out. We know that telling the teacher etc. is the least effective way to deal with it on a 1 to 1 level. Far better to teach your kid to stand up for themselves and encourage them to make more friends.
Systems are not perfect. The legal system is far from it. Unless we want to remove the concept of innocent till proven guilty and reasonable doubt from rape cases. With all the repercussions that may have in false accusations. Then I stand by my comment

@jondspen wtf?

@A2Jennifer What...the prosecutor was a female...but that doesn't go with the narrative of patriarchy rape culture, so I am trying to provide a way to continue to demonize all men, although it was a woman who sold out these female victims. I though you would be pleased.

@jondspen Thank you for your participation. If you have no other enlightening contributions, you can leave now.

@GinaKay You are the only person that has pointed out the prosecuting attorney, an assistant DA, who is probably high up in the department to be given such a high profile case, was a woman who sold out another woman. I am glad you pointed it out, and I agree it is complete BS of a plea bargain. Yet when the OP starts out with "Rape Culture No Myth", I think it's completely reasonable to talk about women obviously enabling a rape culture to exist and flourish. Either there are women out there who like to see rape culture in society, and are obviously in a position to do something about it and don't (which undermines the patriarchy argument), or rape culture isn't real - in that most people think rape is wrong, should be punished, and it's only greedy, cowardly politicians. These same POS who protect their own power/financial interests, and don't give a crap about the people they represent, but will use emotion trigger words to their advantage, and sell them out just as quick if it's to their advantage.

@jondspen I'll have to come back to this tomorrow, but I want to acknowledge your response.

@GinaKay Np. Let me sum up my problem with all these labels; it divides people, and allows further injustice to thrive. Rape culture implies that men can't be trusted and are the root of the problem. It also implies that women are more capable, trustworthy, etc. My point is that is BS. Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely. When someone uses 'rape culture', they are demonizing a whole swath of people, many of whom might very well be honorable. At the same time, they give a pass to another group of being superiority moral and just, only for being withing the opposing group. Using such shallow criteria will one, ostracize good people (men in this case), and two fail to adequately vet women, since they are automatically assumed to be good. Women can be just as deceitful, greedy, selfish, and sociopath/psychopathic as men. While some will still slip through the cracks - at least knowing EVERYONE has the capability to be evil,and vetting them appropriately as best we can (not relying on some rape culture generic box) will we start seeing actual progress in our society. We have got to start doing a better job putting the right people in these places, and holding them accountable, regardless of political affiliation, skin color, or sex organs.

Just for clarification: patriarchy
a system of society or government in which the father or eldest male is head of the family and descent is traced through the male

a system of society or government in which men hold the power and women are largely excluded from it.

And rape culture:
a society or environment whose prevailing social attitudes have the effect of normalizing or trivializing sexual assault and abuse.

@DoctoralZombie I agree, but on this site you see the words are often used collectively and interchangeably. It seems to be the consensus of some (I'm not including you) that money is not the root of all evil, it's men. I think this stems from some sexist belief all men are inherent rapist, and just defective at their core. The only difference is some keep their evil desires in check, and some do not. Seems the OP has this same view since I personally "have enough power already" to control her life, career choices, pregnancy decisions, etc etc etc. Again, I don't attribute any of this attitude to you - you have always seemed to be a reasonable, intelligent, and thoughtful adult.

So you are condoning mob vigilante justice since the elected DA didn't prosecute in the established legal system to your satisfaction? Interesting...

I would imagine there is some truth to what you say.

I'd like to believe we have a functioning judicial system, or even a functioning government. We don't. The systems we have may be comparable to others, but the levels of corruption make it abundantly clear that these systems need to be greatly improved, but again, the corruption prevents this from happening. Therefore, it is indeed incumbent upon those who receive injustice to either seek redress legally, or illegally. As legality generated the injustice, it is understandable if one resorts to illegal means to obtain justice. Blind fealty to a criminally corrupt government is as crazy as blind fealty to a criminally corrupt religion.

@racocn8 I completely agree...and it is your exact argument why I don't believe in rape culture, male privilege, white privilege, or any other such nonsense. There are huge injustices in America, and most can be traced back to illegal or malevolent actions by the government (both dem and rep). People don't seem to realize how much illegal stuff we do domestically or via foreign policy. They just want to bicker between themselves for the scraps on the floor like dogs, while these corporate/bank elites rob us blind.

We usually don't agree, but I do with you on this one. It isn't white privilege...it money privilege, plain and simple.

@jondspen I think it is both. Just look at Brook who also raped a girl, what did he get for it, almost nothing. The Judge said that he had been punished enough and he was a great sportsman. He was rich and white, and there are others. I have not come upon one coloured guy who has gotten away with rape, not one.

@Jolanta Check out #14 [thesportster.com] And while rape and murder are not the same thing, IMO murder could easily be considered worse. Not sure why these black men wasn't just shot dead by a white cop, exercising thier white privilege.

@jondspen Yeah, just disgusting. Have you heard that Chris Brown was arrested in France on rape charges just recently but was let go. Another disgusting incident. He has a very bad track record in disrespecting women and being violent.

@Jolanta No, but that is odd. France uses The Napoleonic Code, so very odd that he wasn't held and charged. Reading the story, sounds like she was a groupie that is just trying to get either some attention or money off him. I mean, all these people and other women, you're partying you ass off with drugs with a known 'bad boy'. Then you're raped in a closet...but it's "too difficult" to explain. I know I will be vilified for this comment; there is no way any woman would ever make up a story or lie - they are always honest and pure.

@jondspen Don't give me that. What kind of talk is that, women always being honest and pure and pigs will fly. There are bad women, just as there are good women, except that in most cases of rape the women turns out to be the one that is the one who gets the blame for it. She was drunk, she asked for it, she did say no but meant yeas, she dressed like a slut, etc, etc.

@Jolanta So you jump from a specific account, that wasn't prosecuted in France with the Napoleonic code (guilty until proven innocent), where the evidence didn't support continuing the prosecution - into general victim pity statement about how the system blames women. My comments were directed toward this one women - who it appears falls into the category of a 'false rape' individual. Are we talking about generalities, or are we talking about this one issue where you are stating that this individual women didn't get justice b/c she was drunk, asked for it, said no but meant yes, dressed like a slut, etc etc etc? I can't engage in dialogue if you change the subject (one specific rape case where it looks like she was not honest, or your belief of a 'rape culture'. I guess since you couldn't defend this women with any reasonable argument, you chose to twist the argument into something completely on a tangent where you believe you can win on moral grounds.

@jondspen I am just broadening the subject. That women was not honest, if you look back to what I said about "pigs will fly" that is all I am doing. It is so easy to start blaming isn't it.

@Jolanta So what's your solution. In the American justice system, a person is innocent until proven guilty. That mean that a person accused of rape is not guilty until a judge and jury have heard the evidence and proclaimed him/her as such. That also means that it is the job of the prosecuting attorney to prove beyond a reasonable doubt the person is guilty. The defending attorney will provide argument that may expose extenuating circumstances, alternate interpretation of the events, or discredit the accuser. So I ask again, what's your solution, keep the justice system in place and operating to protect you as a women if accused of murder, fraud, theft...but in the case of rape by a man, we assume guilt (Napoleonic code)? I know it sucks...seems in many cases people can't get justice (polution, poisoning, murder, theft - mostly by corporate america) b/c the defendant is assumed innocent until the evidence is provided beyond a reasonable doubt. So what legal changes do you think are necessary to work in the real world, not the world of emotions and outrage that the world isn't fair?

@jondspen You know the US system is the same as where I am and a lot of other places in the world. I don't have a solution but seems to me that as far as I have seen from the US is, if you have money and are white you get away with murder or rape. If you are poor and black you cannot even afford the bail and you are in jail sometimes for a very long time. The whole system has to change we have to stop blaming women, it comes from the bible, women are blamed for everything there and it has stuck, no matter what. It is slowly changing.

@Jolanta If you are white and poor you're in jail also. People need to realize it's not a race thing, it's a money thing. And I don't blame women, I just wish women would stop blaming men. This world is dangerous, unfair, and survival of the strongest. Years ago, that very well meant physical strength, whereas today, it's money and political influence (strength to game the system). There are a lot of changes needed, I think you and I can both agree on that aspect. I think where we differ is in where the problem lies - not with race or sex, but IMHO with corruption and greed. And I believe the people wielding the power (money) are using sexist, racist, and political propaganda to divide and conquer the masses (whites against blacks, men against women, left against right).

@jondspen Some of this what you are saying is so but not blame men for rape? What is that all about? Did they women asked to be raped?

@Jolanta Yes....I said don't blame men who rape for rape. I also believe you shouldn't blame people who murder for murder. Sigh - no no, let's not straw man the argument here. "f you have money and are white you get away with murder or rape" - kinda like O.J. - a rich black man? I also said "And I don't blame women, I just wish women would stop blaming men", which is very clear I am talking about the culture of "toxic masculinity" and misandry that exists. Even the education system wants to say there is something wrong with boys, since they don't learn in the same manner as girls. I don't know if it's just blind ideology where you can't see beyond your perspective, or if you are intentionally twisting my comments into something outrageous and ridiculous so you can have an argument with me Either way, my NY resolution was to not waste time past 2 replies engaging with people that can't/won't make reasonable or intelligent comments/arguments on here. I feel this conversation has run it's course. I agree with your initial OP that "Money talks yet again" - and have nothing further to add. Thanks and enjoy the rest of your w/e.