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Went to a reunion in Louisiana. A reunion of descendants of my mother's mother's parents. My great-grandparents. Their property is still in the family. It's well off in the woods. A really great place. I enjoy going.

One problem is, everyone is religious. I usually sit back and go with the flow and don't speak on it. I bow my head when they say the blessing before we eat. Not interested in making waves or engaging in religious talk with them.

I was sitting back listening to the conversation about one of the young ones taking a Bible class and not having learned anything from Sunday School. She was learning about The Old Testament. They were talking about something I hadn't thought about. The Old Testament is pre-Christian. Jesus didn't show up until the New Testament, that being mostly about him. Meaning "Christians" quoting anything Old Testament aren't quoting anything Christian.

Also, there's no such thing as a "conservative Christian". All of Jesus' teachings fall into the current category of "liberal".

Got all of that from acting as a fly on the wall at the reunion. Just listening to them talking. None of them said what I concluded from their conversation. I just figured it out from listening.

david75090 7 Sep 1
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19 comments

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0

Thank you. I will be stealing some of your talking points for future use.

0

I'd bet very few of them are "Liberal christians"😊

I would think most of Louisiana is conservative. Even to those who are probably "liberal" in their thinking, liberal is a dirty word.

@david75090 Yep

0

That place is actually near what I laughingly called my "regular church". I used to take my mother to the reunion before she passed in 2015. All her sisters would be there, we'd spend the night in one of the RVs or with another relative, then on Sunday we'd go to a Methodist church near Lake Clairborne, which is near by. It was the church my mother's first cousin attended. It pleased my mother for me to go, so I went. At the church the pastor would greet us warmly, as did the congregation, which pleased my mother's first cousin. They always served refreshments after the service. I still remember the drill from when I was a kid. Brought back old memories. Not enough to make me want to go to church more than that one time a year, though. Haven't been to that church in probably 10 years, which was the last time my mother would have been well enough to attend. She had dementia.

0

Some christian denominations are trying (subtly) to get away from tho OT. I heard someone say that the OT may be disregarded, as it has been "fulfilled". Anyone else familiar with that? And wth could that mean anyway?

1

I'm sorry you have to endure that stuff. It's simple for me - my family is very small and never has reunions.

5

Yes but how was the food? 😁

The food was good. I bought a chocolate pie from a bakery that tasted home made. I was driving too far to bring something that I needed to heat up. Not as much home made food as in the old days. I'm 68 and have been going to that reunion, with gaps in between, since I was a child. Used to be no one showed up with food that they didn't cook themselves.

@david75090 that was one of the best parts of big family reunions! The food. πŸ‘ It sounds like you had fun despite any religious overtones?

@RavenCT In the old days there would be 30-40 people who broke off into family groups. It was OK since I was there with several close family members. My mother and her sisters knew everybody and the old folks told stories of the old days, like the time the mule fell in the well. This time I went by myself and there was only about 12 people. I talked to all of them and got to know them more than I ever did in the past. There was a few young folks but two thirds were older than me.

2

Oh puh-leeeease!!! Jesus and the new testament liberal?!! Christianity is getting desperate. More and more people are questioning religion, so they are responding by teaching that Jesus's teachings are actually "liberal."

I'm dying!! Rolling on the floor...until I realize there are those that will buy into this...ugh!

Yes Jesus' teachings fall into the liberal category, in contrast to how the "conservative Christians" act. THEY aren't saying they're liberal. They're ignoring the Golden Rule, the story of the Good Samaritan and their Sunday school song of "Jesus Loves Me" about loving ALL the children of the world. "Conservative Christians" aren't about love.

@david75090 If you will pardon the expression "Amen". I also do believe that if Jesus were alive today he would be liberal in thought and deed because of the way the Bible Old and New has been twisted to conform to the need of the moment... I feel you are absolutely correct. My roommate considers herself a "Christian" in every way. I personally don't have a problem with her beliefs, it is what makes her happy and that is a good thing for her. That said, she is actually what I refer to as a "small c" christian or a conservative christian aka right-wing nut. Generally, they do not practice what they generally spout "What would Jesus do" in their daily lives unless, of course, it affects them personally. For some reason, she is offended by me always reminding her of the supposed foundation of Christianity. So, yeah for me most religious folks on both sides but especially who are right-wingers are hypocrites by any measure. Sorry, I didn't mean to type all that out loud...I have been doing that a lot lately. πŸ˜›

11

I was at a gathering the other day and there was a lady who was new. She asked if me and another lady knew each other from church. I said no, no way. If I was ever to set my foot in a church then I would self combuste, I am an agnostic I told her laughing, she looked at me and then laughed. That is how it should be. If people want to go to church then ok, but if people don't then it is fine too.

4

When someone brings up religion, I enjoy exposing their cognitive dissonance by bringing up a religious dilemma or paradox related to what they said.

Christian: "God is good! - All the time!"
Me: "Innocent children suffer and die horrible deaths all the time. How do you reconcile that?"

@MissKathleen I try to present the question as honest and innocent inquiries.

@MissKathleen I can relate. I actually am currently in a similar situation. Sometimes, for me, once they are have resigned to drink the so-called "Jonestown" kool-aid I find I either don't have the strength or the will to bring them to enlightenment. When I think about it, what really gives me a giggle now is how I actually began to change my thoughts on the subject. I was having a conversation with a newly converted Jehovahs Witness couple with children if you can imagine. They cut-out birthdays, Easter, Christmas and I guess even the tooth fairy too. Basically any pagan holiday/rituals still practiced by the church. Also, they don't believe that Adam and Eve populated the earth as implied in Genesis. They asked me if I could explain that after killing Abel, Cain was exiled to the land "east of Eden" where he took a wife...I actually couldn't...So they went on...If all humanity descended from Adam and Eve, then where did his wife come from? For this and other reasons, they converted to their current belief system and what started my journey on my current path of which few are aware.

@MissKathleen Too much of this nonsensical shit can wear a person down

@MissKathleen I actually meant too much time and energy debating it with Christians.

2

>The Old Testament is pre-Christian. Jesus didn't show up until the New Testament, that being mostly about him.

Not entirely. A couple of the Old Testament books included defining which house the messiah would come from and other things to look for. Jesus failed on several of those descriptions, which rabbis will gladly tell you about.

Many forget that the Messiah was to be an earthly ruler of which scripture believers bent over backwards to make Jesus the one. It failed and even riding two different beasts into town at the same time did not work. Once Jesus was crucified he was called "messiah"and the old earthly title took on a heavenly fantasy of its own. What else do you do when they kill your guy?

I understand that the messiah was to be a warrior with a sword and was gonna come ready to kick ass. Am I wrong?

@twill "Sell your cloak and buy a sword." According to the Gospel of Luke (22:36, NIV)

Mon, they must have had some expensive cloaks.

""Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send [or bring] peace, but a sword." Gospel of Mark.

It doesn't mean "let the bloodshed begin."

2

Yeah I'm not an activist when it comes to religion. The way I believe is not the way everybody believes and so why should I push it on other people? I just listened and nod. If they want to talk to me about their religion I listen. If they want to ask me about mine, I am honest and say I don't have one. And if they press I say I've never been religious. And if they push even harder I say that I am a skeptic and need to see evidence before I believe something.

If they want to ask me about mine, I am honest and say I don't have one.

I live dangerously and say "I am a militant atheist. You shouldn't ask for details."

After that it's the scary phrase "prove it."

0

There are some 'Christians' that think the old testament should be separate from the new and not be in the 'bible'. So far, luckily, their opinions are falling on deaf ears.

1

I have noticed more of a trend among Christians to move away from the Old Testament and just focus on the New Testament and Jesus. And, it isn't just more liberal-minded Christians. We used to hear how God, YHWH, created us, well, now conservative Christians say Jesus created us--there is a billboard near my house spouting this.

The OT is problematic as the god described in it is so contradictory; and trying to reconcile the two testaments is impossible when one looks closely. This was a leading factor in my movement away from belief. I could not reconcile the god of the OT with the god of the NT.

If they just focus on the NT it removes some issues; but, the NT itself also has contradictions which is why some, like THE FAMILY, just focus on Jesus (how they interpret him) and ignore everything else.

And, I feel your pain when it comes to being with other family members. All but a couple of agnostic/atheist nephews, whom I don't get to see very often, are Christians--conservative Christians.

I should add, they still love to quote the OT when they want to force its laws/morality onto the rest of us. At least the ones they cherry pick out of the hundreds that are there.

2

The interpretations of the Old Testament by Chtistians has been to find Jesus in every part of if. Afterall, the history of Judaism was all preparation for Jesus comimg the first time, and Jesus as part of the Trinity (which is God along with the Father and Holy Ghost) would be present whenever God is - which is plenty.

MarcionΒ of Sinope was an early Christian who found such a difference in the God of the Old Testament and of the New Testament writings (he was before an official canon was established - he actually set one of the first canons for his sect) that he concluded they were actually different Gods. The New Testament God was higher and replaced the Old Testament God of Judaism. Marcion was eventually excommunicated from the Roman church and I thought I had read that his belief in 2 Gods, one in succession of the other, was officially denounced as heretical at one of the ecumenical councils.

4

The Bible and Christianity say whatever you want them to say.

1

Funny how one can figure things out when one actually uses that brain to think and not to repeat and follow blindly.

3

Jesus specifically stated that he didn’t come to break the old laws but to enforce them so the premise is flawed. These people must not be well versed in the New Testament either.

5

Most "Christians" that I know are a huge bundle of misinformation, misunderstandings, judgmental and hypocritical interpretations - etc etc etc. I do the same thing you do - sit back, be quiet and let them blather on. πŸ˜‰πŸ™‚

@lavergne and hopefully have some wine.

Oh yes, being careful not to step in the dogma.

@oldFloyd i.e. they didn't drink wine, they drank grape fruit.

5

And people take their moral guidance from these allegedly moral creatures

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