So lately, I have been discussing my views with my boyfriend because he's one of the very few I can open up to about being an atheist (due to living in the bible belt and having many religious friends). When it comes down to our difference in views, we begin to butt heads a little because he seems to lean towards the Christian view of a god being the cause of the universe and has no logic to support his argument. I will ask, then who created God or what could his origin possibly be? And he will say nothing, just that God was the beginning of everything. Then he will try to backpedal and say "only IF there is a god would this be the case" but it's obvious he believes it or really wants to. He grew up with a dad who was Jehova's witness and a Catholic mother so he was influenced probably a lot more than I was as a child by religion. I know it can be difficult to let those ideas go but what bothers me is that he defends the ideas with no logic. He even defends the bible as being a good guide to life, NEVER HAVING READ IT. I have, as I was forced to attend confirmation classes, and I suggested he do so before we discuss it. He says he won't. I love him but this is so frustrating. Obviously I feel it is easier to have a relationship with someone who is agnostic than a religious person, but does anyone have suggestions for how to have these conversations without letting the differences come between a couple? I really appreciate any advice.
If you love each other and have a good relationship then just try to avoid the conversation. My ex was a flaming liberal, I'm a libertarian. We knew we didn't agree, so we just accepted that about each other and moved on. If you can't avoid the conversation then learn to accept your differences. But in order to do that, you need to not buy in to what some here want you to believe; that being atheist automatically makes you superior or smarter and that those who have beliefs are just inherently all around stupid. If you already believe that, just break up now because at some point he'll grow tired of that attitude. Particularly because it's just simply not true.
You have to let it go. If you left him and found a guy who had the same belief system you did.. that guy would have some other glaring / deal breaker type of problem. We tend to always find fault with our partners especially when we aren't completely happy in our lives, but really that fault is within ourselves. I've never personally found a good solution to this problem. Every girl I've ever been with who had opposing religious views the issue just got swept under the rug. I think you're lucky he's "agnostic" but it sounds like he has the makings of a religious person.
Hey Talia - count your blessings that he isn't an active christian.
In fact, his um .. open mindedness probably makes him a more desirable person. There IS some good moral guides in the the New Testament "Love your enemies", "Do unto others .." , etc
YOU know it doesn't really matter, that its only your ego that finds it difficult to understand.
Its like snoring, hard to put up with some nights, but its really only a small thing overall.
No need to agree on this point. I read recently of an early Muslim sect that held the view many agnostics hold: wait to see when you die what the truth is and leave it at that. The Sunnis and the the Shiites killed them off quickly.
I don't think anyone has to agree with me so long as they don't try to kill me for my views.Since you both know where the other stands, live in peace and harmony with each other with that knowledge and wait till the end of your lives to see what the truth really is. Enjoy each other now.
You could save time and date a fellow atheist.
How you doin'?
Why on earth don't you chill out and do simple things together , walks in the park etc. and have this as a no go area rather than a ping pong match - this scenario seems to me a recipe for meaningless discussion - which doesnt help your bonding process- Why would it matter? let him be and stop giving yourself a hard time - there must be films you can watch together. Leave this stuff in the closet if you love love him and quit the conversations
I’m an atheist as a matter of faith. Evidence and proof can’t answer the existence or non existence of a deity capable of creating a geological, DNA, and astronomical record that requires blind faith to believe. So, to that degree, I suppose I’m agnostic as a matter of reason, in that were irrefutable proof of the existence of God to be presented, I wouldn’t reject it out of faith.
That doesn’t mean that I would worship the lying rat bastard who has been deceiving us for so long while permitting horrors and atrocities that could easily have been prevented.
A "weak" atheistic (as opposed to "strong" ) is basically an agnostic. I consider myself both. I have 1) no belief in any god or gods, and 2) I see no evidence either way.
Well, when I read your story, I don't think he is an agnostic. A Christian with doubts for the most. I can't figure out why he calls himself an agnostic. An agnostic, doubts that there is a god and tries to find proof for either option. As long as there is no proof and he chooses anyway for the Christian arguments, he is a Christian, not agnostic.
If he claims that he's agnostic, than you should ask why he thinks he is.
I do not understand in what sense this person is an agnostic. Agnosticism would be a claim about what you do not know, Not about what you do know.
I do not know how one can improve a relationship where subjects become problematic to discussion and essentially forbidden. Unless there was some compelling historical reason such as abuse, etc. to leave a subject off the list, I would not, could not remain involved with such a person.
If this is bothering you now, I'd avoid marriage and/or children with him at all costs. It isn't going to get any easier. Belief or non-belief isn't the issue really. It's honestly about his unwillingness to actually research and develop an opinion of his own.
a person who believes that nothing is known or can be known of the existence or nature of God or of anything beyond material phenomena; a person who claims neither faith nor disbelief in God.
An agnostic represents a person whom is neither an atheist nor a theist. However, an agnostic may hold similar beliefs to either, but not entirely; therefore, an agnostic like myself can't relate to either faith or disbelief in God. An atheist and a theist pick a side and can only view life as a pendulum, whereas as an agnostic, I see a scale; this is the reason that I can't relate to either. Like there's only two colors visible: black and white.
If you both can step back and understand that the question is essentially unavailable and unknowable to either of you personally. Then you should both find humility enough to allow for the difference of opinion. If not it would not bode well for other more salient possible differences to be had in a relationship.
I would not call your bf agnostic. I'm agnostic. I do not believe that God exists, but I leave the door open to the minuscule possibility that I could be wrong. I also think that for some people religion is actually a good thing, whether it is true or not.
I think that a lot of you may have missed something fundamental here. Some people will argue about anything! I am reminded of a bit in a Woody Allen film where his parents are arguing "What do you mean, the Atlantic is a better ocean than the Pacific".
You say you live in the bible belt, so I suppose all his family, friends and work colleagues are Christian and if I know those guys they are on his case all the time. You are the only person he can discuss his non-belief with. I will bet you better than even money that when he talks to them, he uses your arguments against them.
You could try this if it gets too much. "There either is a god or there is not a god? If you pick one or the other you have a chance of being right or wrong. If you pick neither you have a 100% chance of being wrong. This is not Schrödinger's cat, now I am bored so lets have sex" (or any other activity you would rather the both of you were doing).
When I got married, 17 years ago, we were both devout Christians. 5 or so years ago I deconverted and am now an atheist, but my wife is still a Christian. We rarely talk about it since our relationship is based on so much more than that. If both parties can discuss religion respectfully without name calling and accusations the relationship can work. If, however, you two feel compelled to constantly debate, and anger is the result, it might just be best to be friends.
Your BF is not agnostic. An agnostic, almost by def, doesn't need to win the argument. Nor do you.
What's wrong with having these arguments? Many arguments are cover for other things going on in the relationship. Stay objective and keep emotions out of the arguments. It's just a discussion.
Well, what I appreciate about agnostics sometimes even more than atheists that is they say I don't know a lot and we don't know everything. There's a starting point. It makes me wonder how he defines god.
I tend to sway to there's something greater and of a higher order, be it a God or some other mythical creatures or kingdoms; there may be layers and parallel universes of which there may be a heaven and a hell and variations of both; however, theists would never accept me and my beliefs. Sometimes, I'm like there's no God; life is shitty. I think that earth may be hell or some prison planet. The point, how in the world I would I know for sure? Therefore, I follow the possibilities that lead to a path of love, compassion, and righteousness; whatever this path may be. Right now, maybe there is a God or realm of benevolent higher order of beings, because I have no idea how I'm surviving everyday.