@Veteran229 at any healthcare or government institution this is clear cut harassment. She does not have to deter his advancements as they were never welcome in the first place. The minute he made an inappropriate comment and touch her, he was in violation.

@Green_eyes @linxminx @Ignostic_Skeptic The only problem with having idiots on block is that you still get to see other people's replies to them.

@Green_eyes I think you need to look at my comment more closely to see who I was referring to (clue: it's someone you replied to).

@Gareth understood. Misread your comment

@Veteran229 Solid observation there Veteran.

I agree with starting a journal and recording everything. You're probably going to need it when you file a sexual harassment suit on him (which is what he's doing). Also, unfriend him from all social media and possibly block him. At least that's what I would do.

@kiramea . . . Maybe. .. .. Maybe this guy will be useful. . . . .
Women: do not discount the immediate offering of orgasms.

DANGER:::: It is a muscle. Use it or lose it. THIS IS NO JOKE!

To refuse an offered penis, at minimum, requires significant fundamental instinctual response. Not just a bit of disdain.

Of course, this is NOT only the man part of me expressing my interest in such activities. It is science that women need to be poked to retain/extend pokabilitiy.

How is that wrong. Only one life to live. So why are we not fucking more?

@Jacar I truly hope this is sarcasm.

If this isn't, I was married to someone like you. I hope to NEVER be involved with anyone like that again.

@kiramea . . semi silly. . . but true a muscle requires use to endure a lifetime.

What is wrong with such a recognition of reality?

@Jacar I thought at first that your comments were just a poor taste joke but from your reply I get the sense that you are actually serious.

Aside from being laughably wrong I think your comments are seriously offensive, whether you are joking or not.

@Cassiopeia . . . please read my words as very supportive of women. "Tis science. And all about women's freedom.

@Jacar as a woman I can tell you that your words are most definitely not supportive of women. Nor is it science (do show your scientific sources) or about freedom. What it does is objectify women and their sexuality.

How could you possibly believe that advising a woman to have sex with someone she has no interest in is about her freedom?

“Women need to be poked to retain/extend pokability”. If you don’t see what is so very wrong with that statement I am not going to try to explain it to you.

You have no understanding of women or their sexuality, neither physically nor emotionally, whatsoever.

As for orgasms, women certainly don’t need men for those. And sex with another person is about so much more than just an orgasm.

Yes, we did learn from Kavanaugh, and from Anita Hill before that. We learned that people in authority don't give 2 fucks about sexual harrassment, and that we will be disbelieved, ignored, and labeled as trouble makers if we complain. Thanks for the advice, tho.

@Emerald

Some don't give a fuck about harassment but some give a great many fucks about evidence.

@Anonbene "Some" being the operative word.

@Emerald
No, "evidence" is the operative word.

@Anonbene only if HR givex a damn. In my hospital they've proven time and again they do not. She knows her hospital culture better than we do. But if she goes to HR and they do nothing, he will make her job far more unpleasant than it is now. Ive been in her shoes. Have you?

@Emerald Some people in authority do care about sexual harassment. Those who don't are still sensitive to a public scandal if they ignore sometime who has solid evidence. Making recordings is good advice. I have a recorder on my phone that picks up everything and I record all of my phone conversations.

@Emerald, @Meili
Thank you Meili, I think Emerald is just in an argumentative mood today.

WHY should she be "nice" to him?
He's a married man, and he's hitting on her at work.
Being "nice" to him isn't going to do anything to discourage him.
Being "nice" is what has allowed assholes like him to get away with they do.

@KKGator Being nice isn't for him ... it's for her. Just because someone else is a jerk doesn't mean you have to be. Unless you want to, then go for it!

@GinaKay I get what you're saying, but I really believe that is what has allowed the problem to get so out of hand. In this case, and every other.

@KKGator Maybe you are right. I have been accused many times of being too nice. Good girl syndrom and all that. But not standing up for myself and not acting was the real problem. Not wanting to cause a scene or becoming emotional could leave me frozen. Learning to say "Stop" is sometimes the best some of us can do. For starters. I'm much better at standing up for someone else.

@KKGator For what it's worth, this has MeToo written all over it.

@godef Honestly, I don't give a flying rat's ass about #MeToo. I don't think it's making a damned bit of difference. This crap isn't going to stop unless and until those who are being victimized (both women and men) speak up, LOUDLY and immediately. Make a scene. Scream "NO!!!" as loud as humanly possible. Make the asshole the center of attention and as uncomfortable as possible, IN THE MOMENT. Everyone who has experienced this, and is experiencing this, has got to grow a spine and start calling the assholes out right then and there, regardless of where they are and when it's happening, OR who is doing it.

@KKGator I fully agree if you are not okay with what is happening you need to stand up for yourself and you need to tell him that he is wrong you are not interested and to leave you alone

@linxminx I agree, ignoring may work at times, but if it happens repeatedly, then stronger measures are needed.

I hate to have a sexist viewpoint in this regard, but men have the potential to be more of a danger when they are the culprits and this type of action is not deterred immediately. I'm very friendly, considerate and thoughtful (as I've been told), and my actions have led to some CONFUSION. In several circumstances, I failed be clear when someone expressed affection for me, because of my own story that I hadn't begun sharing and it led to headache and much heartache. Unfortunately I wasn't a fast learner, because I went through it a few times, before I realized I had to be extremely clear about the possibilities of a relationship. Still, through it all, I never was in a position of danger (though I felt harassed at times); women tend to be more likely to be victimized/harmed in these scenarios.

When you're a woman, sometimes just ignoring it escalates the situation. Also, in addition to the creep factor of a man crossing the line to being inappropriate, there is the threat of physical danger - seldom considered by men who get hit on, but ever-present in the mind of any woman.

I don't think you quite understand socialism but feel free to try to prove otherwise in a more appropriate thread please.

someone doesn't understand politics or relationships.

Stick your thumb up a socialist's butt and you will discover property boundaries>
Something you all don't believe exists

@Donotbelieve I'm so sick of this "why can't we all just get along" bullshit. We can't all get along because assholes take advantage and ruin it for everyone else. Make the assholes start having to deal with the consequences of being an asshole. HE is the asshole in this scenario, NOT her. Who gives a fuck about HIS job? He obviously doesn't care too terribly much if he's willing to risk his livelihood over trying to get a piece of ass.
Fuck him. Blow his life up.

@Donotbelieve Exactly.
I'm telling you, scorched earth is the only way to stop it.

Basically said the same thing before seeing yours!

"to understand him more"!!!! Why should she? HE bloody well knows he is out of line. Why is it always the woman who has to understand where the man is coming from?

@MsDemeanour . . in general it is not about just women. And any one misrepresenting themselves and intentions should be banished.
Esther Perel is exploring the cultural changes that both men and women are experiencing. BIrth control for women is a big change for humans. We still don't know how to deal with that and the reality that everyone wants and needs sexual interaction.

@Jacar well I mean actually you've got a good point there....but he still needs a beat down..

@Freespirit64 . . . Prolly wouldn't hurt. And she might get some release.

For me this is about the assumptions we accept from society about what is acceptable in this period of serial-monogamy. "What is cheating" is at the core of Esther's exploration.

She is explaining that even the best of relationships have "cheating." And it is not primarily the man. And it is not because of any problems in the relationship as is the default goto for an explanation.

But, deception is a form of lying. I am sad anyone has to feel they have found themselves do so, or needing to.

In another thread a women was asking about her need for manly attention because her husband had become an ass. Should she spend the rest of her life celibate because of some undefined vows based upon outdated social "norms" and "morality?" He had essentially broken his vows to her. Is she still obligated?

I think this is a very complicated issue. Cheating is rarely just about sex. It is about how a person thinks about themselves, their human needs, and how the circumstances of their lives are changing.

But, what do I know. I am merely a man.

@lauraleigh38 trust me she knows what a diamond he is . 4 kids . Trust me . And . Not your problem . U need to rescue self and protect others . ♥️♥️♥️

HAAAAAA! I like the Italian/Greek version Miss Pralina.

@powder It's against the law! [dol.gov]

It's against the law.
[dol.gov]

So make the complaint to HR and see where it goes but I can see both sides of this issue so it may backfire on Laura and add further stress to her life. She reports that he inappropriately touched her on the shoulder and on the waist and he denies touching her waist but does recall being compassionate about something and giving her a friendly tap on the shoulder; his recollection and not hers. He says that he did tell Laura that she looked nice on occasion because he knows that she is going through a rough stretch at home and wanted to be supportive and the same reason applies to why he reached out to her on social media which may be written in terms that are nebulous. If the guy is an operator trying to put the moves on Laura then he will have covered his tracks and I'm guessing this is the case from the lack of any comments in the original post stating he said such and such which is clearly harassment instead of 'flirty things like nice way to end the shift with you'. The guy may be a sleaze and is probably aware of Laura's personal life and could be trying to take advantage of her or he might actually be caring and supportive but at this point I think it isn't definitive and could wind up getting spun back at Laura to the point of her competency and professionalism being questioned. I'm not suggesting that is fair but I would want an airtight case before I proceeded. I've had a female co-worker come into my house and take her clothes off, extremely awkward considering I knew she was in a vulnerable state personally and I was not interested in having a relationship with her or a quick sexual encounter, it was inappropriate, I deflected it and got her dressed and back home but it would still later come back to bite me through the rumour mill at the office and I was the villain in her account of what happened, nothing happened at all but that's how these things can go down.

I think because most of the comments assume this guy is a pig, instead of giving him the benefit of a doubt. When she said, "First he added me on facebook...which is fine, others have done the same." I assumed the attention was mutual. I guess if he had not been married with four kids it would have not been a issue.

@MarkF I agree completely with your observation on jumping to conclusions too fast and calling this guy a pig, when in reality we don't really know. Now, thinking out loud, I would say she is asking for external feedback to find validation because she may not dislike him and she doesn't know which way to go. Of course, I could be wrong because back to square one, we don't really know.

Contact wife - interesting approach. There's more varibles there though, for example if his intentions are truly pure and he's just way too friendly (a marriage is unnecessarily disturbed) or if both the husband and the wife are looking for a third and the wife starts adding to the problem...

Yes this is what I should have said. My meter is set differently from the times I grew up in.

** THIS IS CORRECT ^^

I think this sums it up perfectly. I feel like she knows what needs to be done, but thinks there's some slight hope that it is all perfectly innocent. It's not.

Great retort! I love it!

^^^ this is perfect ^^^

I know you're kidding...
If you're not then suddenly she looks like the crazy one, out of a job and has an assault record.
I think she needs to be careful with this anyway so he doesn't make her work situation even worse.

what she said.

She didn’t give him the opportunity. The guy’s a jerk creating the tension.

He sure should have gotten a clear message to leave her alone when she confronted him about his being married. Since he apparently did not get that message, I think your suggestion is probably the best way to go. It might be uncomfortable, but it could stop a bad situation from getting worse.

That’s not you being an asshole. It’s never wrong to stand up for yourself.

I agree he is a pig. I have known many men in my professional career who cheat on their wife. I come right and say I do not and never would do such a thing. Even at this time I was in a terrible marriage and wanted out. I am not a pig nor a disgusting male who throws his shit around daily. Tell this ass to shut it down/ So sorry many women have to go through this and it is very common, we all know this, including men.

Yes! This! Well said