of course there are limits to our militants there are some situations where we have no choice but to show respect for other people's beliefs. it is true they don't show respect for our beliefs. they offer to take our children to church. they say have a blessed day,
this is the water in which we swim
I am very much interested in discussions about Zen, I practice daily and benefit greatly .

@m16566 She was very open minded and had a very deep curiosity about so many things. Huge IQ, if that matters. She was a artist. I benefited because she always told us about whatever she was studying. Between her and my two older sisters whose books I was always taking off with, I was never bored, lol.

Sounds like you miss your mom quite a bit, I lost my father back in 2006.
I still think about him every day, I would love to pick up the phone, tell him about something new on the History Channel. or just have a beer and talk about life.

@m16566 She was a very warm person. I grew up stepping over people in the living room getting ready for school. All had parents that had kicked them out or something, for whatever reason. I don't know how many times someone would tell me how they wished she was THEIR Mother. You could tell her anything and she would be happy to talk about it. The only person I saw her kick off her porch was a Parson who had been caught YET again for touching children and who had to apologize to the parents involved. My brother had told her that he would pay them a quarter for him to chase them around the church in the dark and "catch" them. ugh. Third time and he was STILL getting moved to a different church! She did not forgive him, and I remember being shocked that she hadn't, as that wasn't like her. Now that I am a adult, I totally get it.

keep in mind that her genes are in your body her soul is in your heart. as you live your life you can strive to be worthy of all the thing she gave you.

@m16566 I always do!

You were very lucky, I have to hear that JC bullshit from my daughters. Omg, I wanna puke.

@FlyingEagle1952 I got a brother who is a Republican, church, anti abortion ect.. I still wonder what the hell happened...

would that be for you or for her?
I understand you want to be true to yourself, but at what price

@m16566 For me it would be NOT submitting to her DEMANDS as I was forced to as a child who suffered much under her Domineering, Cruel, Brutal and Abusive ( in ALL the ways you can imagine btw) Reign and Rule, for her, it would be the visible and undeniable statement that she no longer OWNED, Rule over and Controlled me, a massive shock to her system to say the very least.
The price/cost, very little to me but to her, well I leave that to your imagination, but to me the benefit of becoming a TRUE survivor, free at last from her.
Btw, she died alone in April 2000 whilst I was by my teenaged Daughter's side 24/7 in Adelaide, South Australia while my Daughter was undergoing Chemotherapy for Mature B Cell Lymphoma.
We had Medical Permission to return to Broken Hill, some 300+ miles away for exactly 1 week to organize the burial ( cremation actually) of my 'mother(???)' before returning for the next session of chemotherapy and not one iota of a tear was shed by myself nor my daughter since my daughter had suffered from her Abusiveness as well.

it saddens me that you've had so much tragedy in your life.
I to feel victimized by my mother, I don't hold it against her though.
she was doing the best she could with what she knew.
she was young it had a lot of bad advice, I'm lucky I've done as well as I have.

@m16566 My 'mother(???)' was 33 y.o. when I was born so youth was no excuse or alibi.
Her mother was also a very bitter and often domineering person as well so perhaps it was 'like mother, like daughter' in a way BUT she adored and idolized my 4 sibling sisters yet detested me because I was NOT one of them.
It WAS only my Father and myself who copped her brutality, etc, NEVER my sisters and I always copped the blame and the lash from an electric cord for when they did something wrong but NEVER them.

it has been said" hate is a poison that you consume to kill your enemy"
are you working on those early childhood traumas, no disrespect it sounds like it's eating you, I do understand the pain runs pretty deep.

@m16566 Nope, I shrugged off those traumas ages ago, I AM a Survivor and shall always remain one and will support to my utmost those who seek to be survivors also.
That IS the reason why I relate the story because it may inspire someone else somewhere to stand up, fight back and become a Survivor rather than spend their life as a victim.

when I die, I don't want to hear any Jesus Christ bullshit.....they are just as crazy as the Muslims....

@FlyingEagle1952 and hopefully, if you have those that believe in the lie of religion near you, they will give you respect and show you their love by NOT mentioning their belief, which you find so odious.

@Leeshi My daughters are right wing fanatic evangelico Christians, they love Trump too. But they still love me. I am a spiritualist, not by wishful thinking, but by experience. I didn't know what is was in 1994, it took me years to find out.....I experienced a kundalini awakening, not fun either. I have to hear this JC bullshit all the time. I have 2 daughters and both of their husbands are studying to be ministers. I usually go to the Xmas services for my grand kids, but i've stopped that....no more. My daughters know I want no discussion of Jesus Christ over my ashes.....that's for sure. There has been nothing that has contributed more to mental illness than Christianity. There is one sick God......omg.....so sick.....end of story. BUT......there is life after death.....we are in fact beings of light.....it's all about light frequencies......and it is important to LOVE AND BE KIND. WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND.

@FlyingEagle1952 while I respect your right to believe in whatever you choose, I find it a bit hypocritical that you, who believes in some form of higher power (if I am mistaken in my understanding of what you just posted, please let me know), are calling others that believe in a different higher power crazy. What makes your higher power so much more realistic than theirs?

@Leeshi It's not about a 'higher power"....it's physics......light frequencies......consciousness is consciousness......what makes ME ME....and YOU YOU. When our body dies, we must exit these physical bodies. It has nothing to do with what you believe, your religion. It's biological phenomenon. My mother believe there was nothing after you die. She passed in 1994. Well, .....too bad....but wrong. At the end she went into severe shock because she was not prepared for what was going on. Neither was i. There is a great book called THE JOURNEY OF SOULS, by Newton. He was a skeptic.....but just ran into too much evidence. It's a great book. So is BEYOND THE LIGHT by PMH Atwater.........i had dinner with PMH.......another one LIFE AFTER LIFE, by Dr Raymond Moody. I had dinner with Raymond Moody, the man saved my life. And Dannion Brinkley, he wrote SAVED BY THE LIGHT. I had dinner with Dannion too. Dannion was dead for almost an hour.......they made a TV movie about him and he was on Phil Donahue 4 times. Get on YOUTUBE and watch Ebin Alexander.....he is a brain doctor that died. He will blow your mind. I went IANDS meetings for 10 years, my experience was in 1994. Good luck....

I think a loving mother would ask this if she was convinced her child's eternal life was at stake.

@brentan A religious mother would, but not a loving mother. A loving mother will love her children unconditionally.

@SleeplessInTexas A religious mother couldn't help but see it as loving. And who knows, maybe she does her love her children unconditionally.

@brentan I stand firm on my disagreement here. I see your point, though.

Deathbed or not, I will not compromise myself for anyone. They won't be around to worry about me. My answer will not affect them once they're gone.

My mother thought that "this was it".....and there was nothing after death. Well that changed.....ON HER DEATH BED. People who think there is nothing after death are in for a big surprise. This whole place is about light frequencies. When our consciousness is attach to our physical bodies, we only see this frequency. However, when you detach, other things happen. It has nothing to do with what you believe. Reincarnation is for real, we are in some kind of evolution......We are multi-dimensional beings. Hey, let me tell you.....it's big, and it's moving fast!!

@FlyingEagle1952 sure...whatever you want to believe..but you should do a little reading on what that light is...brain scientists have explained it quite simply and it is a phenomenon that can also happen when we meditate...I prefer to listen to science rather than some woo-hoo

[science.howstuffworks.com]

@thinktwice it was simple, I was just like you. I knew nothing about "Beings of Light".....I asked the Angels to do something for me to prove to me they were real. Well, guess what? They did it. So how does a chemical reaction in your brain create events? Then other things happened after that. When you are NOT in your body , you are a ghost. The Lotus Flower, the astral plane, life after death....it's all about light frequencies. The spiritual world is much larger than this world. CONSCIOUSNESS!!!I was happy for my mother, I know I will see her again in the next world. Get on YOUTUBE and watch Eben Alexander, he tells you the way it is. Happy landing.

@FlyingEagle1952 Glad you have have found a way to explain what you want...just as there are stories like yours, there are just as many that nothing happens...so who knows one way or the other...I already went through my phase of studying esoteric things and have come to the same conclusion...and there are always going to be YouTube videos that try to "expand" our awareness and explain things...might as well be the Bible in my mind...another man telling others what it is all about and yet never offering scientific proof...

Was it a Catholic Priest???? He was probably corn-howling the kid.

@FlyingEagle1952 Protestant Baptist. And my friend was an adult. No corn holing

@count_viceroy i hate catholic priests...... As you can see....

In a scenerio like the one you mention here, I would say, 'No'. I know myself.

The inner warrior in me will fight to the death before being forced to do anything that goes against my morals.

I'd take charge and lead a fight so brutal against my enemies, they would beg me to kill them or they'll just have to kill me.

If I'm going die on any given day under those circumstances, I'm going in a blaze of glory like a true badass!

if I could say what I had to say, Aveda lay and Escape I would.

Same!

If your own mother hates you, you are really fucked.

why it sounds like you have some history with this question?
did you lie about your beliefs and somehow it came back to you?

@m16566 I was about 12 or 14 years old and at a revival service. (I come from a long line of Baptists) In my heart I didn’t believe the Christian message, but I allowed this sexy girl to talk me into going forward and saying that I had “accepted Christ”. It gave me a cheap feeling and I never got anything out of it—not even a kiss.

I lived the lie throughout adolescence but in college I got up the gumption to put my foot down. I’m still not an atheist BTW. There are god-like concepts that intrigue me greatly. I don’t actually “believe” those concepts. For me it’s not about belief or disbelief, rather it’s about reverence, and awe of the overwhelming mystery of existence as a consciously aware entity.

You deserved a better Mum

Precisely why reply was "No chance," because I suffered for years under an abusive, nasty, cruel vicious thing that called itself my 'mother.'

U never dissapoint me ma'am on any comment of yours . I can see kindness and I can see the wisdom .

@Pralina1 Thank you my dear...I may be getting wiser with age...I like to think so.

in all ethical dilemmas, I think we should always seek to do the least harm.
for myself if I had to be baptized to accept Jesus to keep a job I wouldn't.
if I had hungry children that I was responsible for I might.

Gosh yes, having a family can really change how we think. I guess we're just not thinking for one person anymore.

Ditto.

Why not santa claus? Popeye the sailor? Batman? Lassie? Rin tin tin? The wizard of oz?

Why do you believe that, as a skeptic I'm always looking for evidence.
it is logical that energy cannot be created or destroyed.
I have no reason to believe that when the brain dies, everything connected with it dies, and death is in Oblivion

I think a lie told for the greater good is excusable.
clearly mom in my scenario is wrong.
I asked what's decision causes the least pain?

Thanks for the Sunday morning laugh.

so unusual to have parents that are atheist, it must have been a unique experience growing up. where they militant with religious people?
did your friends try to recruit you into their religion?

I'm not a Christian anymore, I was raised Lutheran though. I think that the message Jesus had was the golden rule. But if you look at the world today, you don't see a lot of it. The churches are making a lot of money too.....lots of money off of Jesus. They are businesses. It's about controlling you and getting your money.

Whenever were faced with a moral dilemma it becomes necessary to choose the course that will do the last harm.
of course we do not want to sell out our own values, we don't believe in The Invisible Man controlling everything sometimes our loved ones do and out of love for them we need to feed their delusion