@bbyrd009 "I AM that I am; tell them I AM has sent you" (God to Moses, supposedly). Sounds like a pretty strong existence claim right there.

So you're going the tired route of claiming there's a difference between faith / belief and religion. The "religion of one, so its not really religion" routine. Or maybe it's the "religion vs relationship" route. Or the "man reaching up to god vs god reaching down to man" route.

It all gets codified into tribal dogmas (religion) in the end. Whether it's the Holy Roman Church or Bedside Baptist or just little old you telling people what's true and what's false, it's all the same.

@mordant "Sounds like a pretty strong existence claim right there." at first, yes, but if you read the whole passage and then read our common def of "exist: have objective reality or being," another truth begins to become evident imo. The AM part is almost universally read as like a title, which anywhere else Am would be sufficient for that, and almost never read as EMPHATIC, and so the rest of the passage is discounted and misunderstood. So, and i know this is strange ok, but i believe in God, or Allah, or Krishna, doesnt matter imo as these are strictly concepts, but i do not believe God "exists," nor were the authors nor "God" trying to forward that pov?
The arg being that as soon as one insists upon God's "existence," like "believers" do, one will also manufacture the essences of Existence onto God, Old White Guy in a White Robe and a Big Beard, etc. An interesting corrollary here is that you will never find a "believer" who actually has any "belief" whatsoever in God's existence! They all hold that to be an Absolute Truth, and it cannot even be debated?" At least until they read that passage and some of Job with me, wherein we almost always get to see who Satan really is too

@mordant "So you're going the tired route of claiming there's a difference between faith / belief and religion." Samaritans were considered evil and not accepted then, but we are told to "go and do likewise." And there is no judgement for beliefs in the Bible, as most believers tacitly demand? Who also conflate faith and beliefs right away, in their efforts to attain heaven after they have died. Yet no one has ever gone up to heaven, and there is only One Immortal, which no believer will appreciate you Quoting either. You and your sons will be here with me is the assurance to believers (who will not accept it) that all go to the same place.
We mostly proceed from the pov of the Bible that believers have disseminated, see, and we do not ever hear these parts of the Bible, but when the OT is realized as a record of the failure of a religion, and John Baptist and Jesus of Nazareth ("John Doe from out of Nowhere," searchable btw) as two guys sticking two big Middle Fingers straight up in the air at The Man, then wisdom is no longer hidden from the wise. These were not religious or even pious ppl, these were rebels on the run from the law? And religious ppl are "the wise" as far as the Bible is concerned (idiots, iow) he who says he knows does not yet know

@mordant "It all gets codified into tribal dogmas (religion) in the end. Whether it's the Holy Roman Church or Bedside Baptist or just little old you telling people what's true and what's false, it's all the same." well, it does if you do that, yes. But now see what you have said becomes the reasoning for why the truth must be hidden: nations of ppl grow to a point where they demand a king, ppl want to be led, "sheep" iow, and so if one wants to "believe" that they might say some Magic Words in a mortgaged building they call "church" to a guy who has made a deal with the king (501, 6, c3, 6, 1023, 6) and then they will go up to heaven after they have died (mithraism), they can certainly do that, but they will be made to be hypocrites by their own Manual, see. Leave the camp, come out of her, my people, scapegoat, it's all in There ok, just in code. "Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power." see, just what you want too right, if you focus on the end, practical part and ignore the big, flowery, meaningless part at the beginning?
Iow you are exactly correct, most ppl will do what you say, and you now have a means for IDing those types and being advised accordingly? Bc trust me the authors of the Bible consider them idiots. Anarchy is not Chaos.

Yes!

God never makes the claim of existence according to our definition, not anywhere. Swing anna miss, sweetie.

@bbyrd009 which god “sweetie?”

Regardless, how can a nonexistent thing make a claim? My unicorn claims existence, prove me wrong!

@Marcie1974 Except for the people who, as one comment suggested, were/are mad at god and then "abandoned god." That to me is different than not believing god exists--hence the reason for the poll.

@Marcie1974 oh, my apologies, i'm from the deep south, bad habit with the sweetie thing i guess. God makes no claims of "existence: having objective reality or being" anywhere, that i am aware of? Allah doesnt, and YHWH doesnt, and Krishna doesnt?

I hope you find those posts

politics and religion are necessary to each other, vital even i guess. Obviously the "existence" or non- of a God or gods is paramount to your existence lol, regardless of your feelings on the matter

thanks for your comment, maybe you can explain to the people who are incredulous here that such a belief could exist.

@lerlo All kinds of beliefs exist that are believed without any evidence to support those beliefs, it's called faith.

“We either base our 'confidence' on reason (evident probabilities, past experience, competence, etc) or we base our beliefs on faith, which is blind by definition. Faith is the most dishonest position it is possible to have, because it is an assertion of stoic conviction that is assumed without reason and defended against all reason. If you have to believe it on faith, you have no reason to believe it at all.”― AronRa

@zblaze really like the quote you referenced. And thank you for your comment. Saved me the trouble.

I'm not confused at all and if you read the comments from the people who say they are mad at god, it is possible. I'm not accusing you of being mad at anything, it's just a choice. Some people decided god didn't exist one way, some people never stop believing but are just mad. Some were mad and then stopped believing. Happy for you to show me where I told you you were mad at god

@lerlo I get the feeling that you are looking for an argument. Lighten up, learn to laugh. Just a suggestion.

@itsmedammit which part of me being confused wasn't an argument?

As does your spelling As one comment probably correctly concluded, people might not admit being angry with god. Some of the comments get pretty angry over a pretty innocuous post. Why would someone who is not angry with god get upset about the suggestion that some people are angry with god unless I hit a nerve? A couple people had no problem admitting that they were once angry with god.

@lerlo read this.
[sciencealert.com]

only if you don't believe

I take from your comment that God and religion are separate

@Ruby_Slipper Wow --new concept to you that religion and god may be inseparable? Ok genius walk me through how my comment makes me a religious believer--I can't wait

@lerlo I refuse to interact with trolls. Crawl back under the bridge you came from.

@Ruby_Slipper apparently you have nothing else to do and I will continue to defend my right to post as I feel necessary and deal with the less competent as they come my way. The only people who cry "troll" here are the people with no arguments to the contrary and who think that such a cry will get them noticed. You've succeeded in being noticed as someone without a clue or who is mad at god and is afraid to admit it. I'll be here as long as you will unless admin decides to admonish you for your personal attacks.