I was reading a post by a member about how hard it is to find love with another atheist because not too many people identify as such. I have to agree with him. I have these two situations that I am currently in and I would like to ask what the members of this community would do in those situations.
First. In my field of work I have to meet with clients and do their Medicare plans, insurance plans and retirement plans for them. A vast majority of them ask me either when I first meet them, or at the end of our meeting if I am a Christian and if I have accepted Jesus as my savior. I have heard on many occasions from clients and potential clients that they would not do business with anyone who is not a Christian.
Second. I am talking with this girl and she is a good person, and almost every conversation and text and meme that she sends me has God bless you. Thanks God. God willing. Everything starts with something about God. It wasn't like that when we first started talking, but now that she has gotten more trusting and comfortable with me, she says them all the time. I haven't decided whether to pursue this relationship further. I am weary of getting involved with someone who is too religious. I do value our friendship, but I can see that she wants more and I don't want someone that is too religious.
My two questions are.
1- Would you answer no to the question of being Christian and accepting jesus and severely endanger your ability to earn a leaving.
2- On the relationship scenario. Would you come out and say to this other person that you do not believe in God and potentially lose a friend.
Not only with regards to atheism per se but with any semi-personal joke or comment.
For years I would tell coworkers to never worry about hurting my feelings. I've always been more comfortable with forthright relationships.
The time they should start to worry is when I stop joking with them because that means that I don't trust them.
With people I've just met of course (as customers), I wouldn't have time to learn trust or gain theirs so I would tend to avoid personal comments. With customers if they asked that sort of question I'd play the professionalism card and not answer. If they wanted to make (likely correct) assumptions they could.
For the love interest... I've been out of the game for a very long time. But all my life honesty has been one of my driving principals. If my positions were a problem for her, oh well.
For both questions, I've never (that I know of) been forced to end a relationship that I was serious about.
I always try not to hurt people, but I've never been driven to lie. (knock on wood.)
That first situation is really inappropriate. Your clients seem like assholes. Whether you work for a company or independently, I suggest you answer them by saying you don't discuss politics or religion during work hours.
Second situation. I would tell her, but tell her in person. That way you can get a reaction and see how she feels about it. If you tell her over text, you risk being ghosted.
I would never tell a client or customer my religious views. Easy out is to say your company prohibits the sharing of personal information.
As for the second scenario, I’d be honest. It’s not a true friendship if either person lies.
I was thinking of telling her that I am not a religious person, and I don't believe in an all knowing God. I treat everyone with respect and respect everyone's right to have their own beliefs. I do the right thing not because I expect a reward in the afterlife or fear punishment in the afterlife and just leave it at that. The next move is hers.
1.) I kiss ass in all sorts of ways chasing a dollar. I should be a prostitute at this stage because bending over and sucking it are just how it is. I'd probably make more money and have more time off if I were just to surrender to being an actual hooker versus a desk-hooker ... or something like that. (Yeah, get a rosary, wear a hajib, buy cheesy religious shit to put on your desk. Sell, sell, sell!! Cash your checks! If you don't, someone else will.);
2.) Whole different thing. No way. (Relationship, that is. Should you tell her you're a non-believers? Of course. True friends accept differences as much as similarities. You'll find out just how Christian she is, too. If she loves you regardless, she's the real deal. Hmmm...can you be the real deal of a big fat lie/fantasy? Eh. You get the idea.)
As a lifelong atheist, I feel comfortable telling people I am atheist. But I refuse to discuss religion at work.
"Will you donate to our women's shelter?" a woman asked in front of a grocery store. "What's it called?" I asked. Haven of Hope. Instantly I was suspicious. Are they pressuring pregnant teens to not have abortions?
"Is it a Christian shelter?" I asked. Yes.
"I'm an atheist," I replied. "I don't support Christian organizations." She laughed.
I don't know if she laughed at my being an atheist. Frankly, I don't care.
Me, too. I tell Salvation Army bell ringers why I won't give them money.
"The Salvation Army is anti-gay," I say.
I diplomatically avoid answering the question about religion. I know if I dit honestly I would not have 90% of my clients. The relationship scenario will probably stay as friends. I would tell her if I decided to pursue a romantic relationship, but I have had bad experiences with people who are too religious and think that they can change you.
If asked any such a personal question, in a business setting, I would clearly state that I was there to do business. Period. You could frame your reply with, "I'm sorry, I am here to discuss your (whatever)" and then go right in to your pitch.
Run from the girl! It is likely she is only hanging around to convert you.
I have avoided disclosing at work. It has influenced how people worked with me. Since they are asking you directly, you might say something like "my beliefs are very personal to me and I choose to not make them part of my professional life".
I would be vomiting if someone were to constantly be doing the bless you, God willing thing, Go, Go God thing.
For work... I would use the "3rd Party."
"I'm sorry, my employer frowns upon talking about politics and religion with our customers. I hope you understand."
Keep the girl as a friend and be honest and tell her that you feel uncomfortable with her increasing religiosity. (If that is a word... It sounds good to me!)
The work patt I use ygrir own religious teachings to answer no to the question and th hey do not even realize it. I am not going to pursue a relationship with her. Staying friends is ok with me. They always say that it doesn't matter and think that they can save you. Past experiences have thought me that.
A god that doesn't exist can't hear you lie. & I don't find it terribly immortal to lie to someone who's main principal in life is to tell the same lie to themselves.
A friend is someone that you can be open & honest about talking about how you really feel & see life. Can't lose something that isn't real.
you might tell clients you aren’t comfortable discussing your private life or that you aren’t allowed by your company.
i would recommend telling your friend though. secrets poison relationships, and it’s better to let someone go than let that fester between you. it might hurt you both eventually.
If I decide to pursue the relationship I will tell her the truth. I have told her that I am comfortable with being friends for now. The work situation I have avoided answering the question so far.
@noworry28 it’s your decision to make, but i suggest telling her now. even a friendship can be ruined by that sort of thing. i’m specifically talking from a similar experience because i kept my sexuality a secret from a friend who i knew wouldn’t approve, and it ended up hurting us both in the end. like i said, it’s your decision, no pressure. just consider what it might do to your relationship.
I would ask them why it matters. Why they feel only an xtian can meet their needs. Ask them how they would feel if you asked them and refused to deal with them because they were xtian. Find a few quotes about acceptance and charity from the bible and quote that at them asking them if they believe and follow the bible. I would not lie but I am not in your situation.
I would ask them why they talk about god a lot and tell them that I don't believe, they will either accept you for who you are, try to "save you" or walk away. I have done this and they walked but better to know up front rather than later.
Good luck either way.
To answer your first question: you should tell them that you are religious. I've seen this kind of problem for the first time. Earning a living of more important than anything else in life. Minor lie like that should be acceptable.
To answer your second question: If she's a friend, you should say that you are uncomfortable with their bringing in religion every time. Tell them openly that you are an atheist. If that person is not stopping even after you made it clear, are they really your friend? If they stop then well and good.
I would lie.... I would not say I have accepted him as my saviour because even as a catholic i never said that kinda BS... I would just say yea I'm christian I was baptized as a baby etc etc
Once again, even when I was religious I did not add god bless or god willing and invoke god constantly into convos... that makes me think her religion is a huge part of her identity and hence an important part of her life, and she would probably want a man that is "god fearing" or god loving too. I hypothesize she'd eventually try to convert you or that she wouldn't be okay with you as an atheist. I would have to find out just how far and deep her religious beliefs are before trying to pursue anything.
For your work interactions, you could say that your spiritual views are personal and private.
For a potential dating partner, you could hint that you are interested in getting to know her better, but you wonder if she'd be interested in spending time with someone seemingly not quite as religious as her. This might prompt a frank conversation.
I've noticed that sometimes when people want to show potential affection for someone, they tend to ramp up some "god bless you" wishes, feeling it will show their warm feelings. It could be that this girl is not all that religious, but is following with habits commonly used when showing interest in potential suitors. I've sure seen plenty of people who are not religious in the least throw "God" comments around without thinking.
I would say I believe in Santa Claus so as not to endanger my ability to earn a living .I could not care a crap.As the 2nd question goes ,you have to see if she is a fanatical religious Church going nut .If she is just a believer and not overly religious I would not make an issue of it and see what happens .As I see it, a fanatical non believer who shuns believers is no better than a believer who shuns non believers.
I'd decline to answer the question in my proffessional life - religion isn't what I'm being paid to do or talk about and since I don't turn clients down based on thier religious views I don't feel the need to discuss it at all and prefer not to. Talking about god on the clock is what preachers do, and I'm no preacher.
If you're honest with her about what you believe without insulting what she believes, and she returns that courtesy to you you can have a good friendship with her.
Agree on the relationship answer but from past experiences they always think that they can change you to their way of thinking and make you a believer. I will keep it on a friend only relationship. Unfortunately the clients that I have would not do business with me if I answered no. I am self employed and have my own business. I avoid answering the questions. I answer indirectly by using their own religion. Surprisingly it has been easy to tell them no without them figuring out that I am saying no.
@noworry28 that's why you both need to respect each other's beliefs/lack of. She keeps trying to change you doesn't sound like much of a friendship.
Dunno what to tell you about clients, except be careful they don't find out you don't believe when they think you told them that you do. That'll be worse than just saying you don't believe to thier faces.
In the first scenario, it's your work. While I would freely say I don't believe, not everyone else is that secure. I'm pretty defiant, and I have no problem challenging
believers. I'd ask them if they were happy with my service before answering that
question. If they replied in the affirmative, then I'd ask them why it would make a difference if I didn't believe the way they do? Take your cues from that.
It's your integrity, no one else's. Only you know what you can and cannot live with.
You didn't say if you're an independent contractor, or if you work for an agency.
If you work for an agency, and they provide the clients, you have more flexibility.
They can't fire you, and they still provide new clients.
If you run your own business, that creates more of a sticky situation for you.
As far as the second situation goes, I would try to discuss the issue with her,
and depending on what she says, then I'd decide whether to allow things to go
Just remember, believers often say "it doesn't matter" to them, then they turn
around and make a big deal out of it.
I've just learned to pass them by. I don't feel like they can't be trusted anyway. They believe in delusions. I try to avoid the delusional as much as possible.
Again, only you can decide what you can and cannot live with, or without.
i think it does not depend on the agency at all. colorado, for instance, where i live, is an "at will" state. i can be fired, summarily, for anything at any time with zero explanation.
First scenario I am an independent contractor and run my own business. I have maneuvered around answering that question so far. Second one I have been in the situation where she said it didn't matter and then made a big deal about it.
@noworry28 I can't be involved with believers anymore. Eventually, regardless of them saying "it doesn't matter", it DOES matter.
I've had to walk away more than once. Usually always after being told that I'm turning my back on a good thing, AND "eternal life".
Don't know what to tell you about your work.
I'm retired now. I don't have to think about that stuff anymore.
Again, good luck.
@lakota_5 Yeah, I thought about that after I posted. As others have said, better to not discuss it at all.
I'm so damned glad I don't have to deal with all that bullshit anymore.
Back in the day, I got away with shit (mostly just insubordination--I still did my job) that would get me fired in a skinny minute now.
@KKGator back in the day... when i was young and hot... i dated a few A listers in NY and LA. models and actresses. and... i compromised myself... a LOT... for their hotness. A LOT. was it worth it... um... sure. some serious hotness for me for a little bit. today, i am not young nor am i hot. so i am not generally chasing the young and scorching any longer.
@KKGator Same here. Past experiences have thought me that they always think in the back of their mind that they can make a believer out of you. They might say that it doesn't matter but it does to them and it will blow up in the end. That is why I am not going any further than friendship.
Let your clients know that you've adopted a personal policy to refrain from discussing religion and politics with clients. That you would rather concentrate and focus on their needs and requirements iro of their personal insurances and retirement planning.
As for your lady "friend" - it already sounds too weird to form any healthy friendship or a relationship. Be honest regarding your views on the "god thing" and hope she still values you as a friend. If she takes offence with your thinking then you should really consider walking away from someone trying to "recruit" you instead, however nice she may be.
You don’t have to lie just address it as a privacy issue because it is. If some client persists use someone’s suggestion about your company’s policy on that and other similar matters.
I would lie to strangers who really have no business asking in the first place, especially if it was going to affect my ability to earn money and nobody is being harmed by the lie.
I would be very up front with the girlfriend about how you identify religiously before another minute passes.
For the job situation, I would throw it back at them with the bible. When they ask if I have accepted Jesus as my savior, say
"(If) you believe in the bible, (god) protects all mankind. Asking that question goes against God's wishes. According to the good book, only god can decide who is worthy. He who cast stones.... (put the onus on them for “sinning” )”
On the dating, I refuse to even communicate with devout Christians anymore. I don't care if someone is religious as long as they don't try to convert me. Just move on and find someone else.
I would tell her the truth if I was going to pursue a romantic relationship but I will stay friends with her. They always think that they can change and save you. Work wise I answer no by using their own teaching and they don't even realize that I am answering no.