While on a long drive recently, I was listening to a show on NPR about immortality and time. The one person made a great point about the question: would you really want to live forever? They said, imagine you are now immortal and won't age anymore. Then, count up the scars you have at what ever age you are. Then, how many might you have in a 100 years or a thousand. And, at some point what are the odds you lose a limb or another body part through an accident. After a moment of pondering that, the scientist added, and even if you made it a million.years, how much would have mankind evolved without you, if mankind survived at all. My question to you all is: would any of you wish to be immortal?
I battle depression, anxiety, and ADHD. I think people are generally not good (an occasional good deed does not make a person good). Doing this thing forever? Hell no.
Scars? Losing a limb? My fantasy of immortality requires complete regenerative capacity where there are no scars, otherwise fatal wounds are healed immediately and limbs grow back faster than a starfish. I would only wish immortality if it were a communicable condition.
In this reality, can mental scars be healed as well? Because if I would be stuck living an eternity with depression/anxiety then fck that. I am finding a way to restore my mortality!
@demifeministgal It seems to me that overcoming depression and anxiety would be the goal of any sensible person, whether or not they are immortal. But that should not, in my view, mean the total erasure of memory, or removal of the emotional scar, as this would result in a reduced awareness of the suffering of others. It is the recollection of our own experiences of both physical and emotional pain that enable us to empathize deeply with other creatures.
I am not lacking sensibility here either. You assume clinical disorders are something one can overcome or heal from, like a broken limb, rather than something one lives with and manages the symptoms of. You'd be surprised the LIFElong effects on the brain and body that trauma has. Also, empathy is actually an evolutionary trait. And one can definitely learn or be socialized to be empathic WITHOUT having to suffer needlessly. Plenty of people that have not suffered have developed or possess empathy after all.
"Empathy makes us reach out to others, first just emotionally, but later in life also by understanding their situation.
This capacity likely evolved because it served our ancestors’ survival in two ways. First, like every mammal, we need to be sensitive to the needs of our offspring. Second, our species depends on cooperation, which means that we do better if we are surrounded by healthy, capable group mates. Taking care of them is just a matter of enlightened self-interest."
@demifeministgal I assumed you to be a sensible person from the start for wanting to overcome depression and anxiety. My apologies if it didn’t appear so. Also, I assume no such thing regarding clinical disorders. My point is that, in this context of an entirely hypothetical discussion of immortality, once healing occurs, a removal of the memory of this suffering would be counterproductive to our ability as humans to empathize—a capacity that I agree is evolved, and without which we would not be here.
Yes, we can empathize without having experienced the same pain or anguish, but just as there is a difference between the theoretical and the practical, those who have suffered in the same manner are best equipped to walk in the other person’s shoes. For example, although all of us have experienced the pain and hurt of humiliation, how many of us were mocked by a school teacher for stuttering? Joe Biden’s experience in this particular area enables him to empathize more deeply and to win the trust of a young stutterer more effectively than most.
I'm 57 now and often feel 200 so by the time I croak it it'll have felt like an eternity.
I would not mind living my earlier days over again but only if I had the knowledge that I have today. Going back in time to re-live everything again would be hell.
@DenoPenno yes those earlier days ...but you'll need the technology too, coupled with what you know now. For now it's just in movies I look forward to space travel instead.
Here are some links to actual science that is currently in development on this subject. A combination of these sciences could make immortality a viable option within our lifetimes.
They could at least let me try...
If I was immortal I would have time to find a way to "End" it all if I decided I didn't like it.
Netflix has a movie called "The Old Gaurd" deals with this very issue. Well done and addresses male sensuality in a really healthy way. Now I think, in some ways, we are all immortal. It is just that we don't occupy the same physical form throughout time. I have had this same form for years but before that I was a powerful woman warrior for more than a millennium.
Before that I was a hairless cat, for 200 years,whose owner ran a juice bar in a galaxy not far from here.
Before that I am not at liberty to talk about what I was
Wait, what?
I watched that. It isn't too bad.
It's not the loss of limb that makes living untenable. I think it's the loss of meaning in our lives that makes us welcome death. If I can somehow find meaning in the life I would have to suffer, I think I would like to continue living. Obviously, I have been reading Viktor Frankl
No I wouldn't want to live forever, but I wouldn't mind having George Wells time machine (the one with the disc on the back) either that or a TARDIS but I liked the time machine it has pursed leather seats and fancy blinking lights.
Being a Dr Who would be advantageous.
@Beowulfsfriend provided you do not have any problems with the eye of Harmony in the cloister room..
Immortality all the way for me. Medical technologies improve and may eventually replace all body part, including DNA with fixes and longer telomeres. I have no problem with humans evolving faster than me.
Even though I may not dies physically, there is a limited amount of neural synapses in a brain. Neural synapses are what makes us who we are and what memories we retain. Over a million years these synapses will be reconfigured replacing old memories with new ones. At some point I will suffer a "synaptic rewrite" death as all my old synapses are reused for holding new memories and thinking processes. At that point even though my physical for is the same, the way neurons are connected is different. I, as I originallly was, will not exist.
hell I didn't really want to live to THIS age lol
Same. hehe
I would be perfectly happy to be immortal. I know I'm not though, and I can accept that. The real test, I think, is to ask... If those who say they don't want immortality had to choose the last day of their life, even if their health never declined, would they ever do it? Life expectancy used to be 45. So why have all these 60 year olds not offed themselves? Lets say we continue to extend life expectancy. You're a healthy, happy 127 year old and most folks are living to 138. Who's gonna volunteer to end their life? Nobody. If most people are living to 200 who will volunteer to leave at 150? Nobody. No healthy person wants to die.
Me! I have accomplished anything I would want to accomplish, seen all I need to see, loved move than I deserved. I am ready to go anytime.
@Barnie2years
What keeps you here?
@skado because I am in relatively good health, and my life is quite pleasant and affords me enough joy that I embrasse each day. Plus, suicide hurts those who care for you much more than it helps the person who does it. That has prevented me from doing it at various times in my life when I didn’t see a reason to go on. I would never do that to my parents and friends.
@Barnie2years
What if medical technology advances to the point the only way to die is by choosing to?
@skado I would not worry about things I don’t believe will happen. We can’t even control a little virus. Like I said, I live today and have no worries about what tomorrow may bring.
If anything, at some point I expect the average age to go down, except for the very wealthy who will be able to afford whatever new fangled science comes up with to keep some part of a person viable.
It doesn’t change the fact that I would not take extraneous measures to extend my life just for the sake of my own ego. I do have a DNR and my son has been instructed that no heroic measures need to be taken just to keep my heart beating.
mans quest for eternal life, I believe, is a manifestation of his inability to cope with the fear of the unknown.....
@Redneckliberal
...but I do want to go into the unknown, that's where I differ. I don't have a fear of it. I've always had a curious mind. Love the idea of ageless, timeless, maybe 1000 years but not infinity. Technology will be advanced enough to give me enough time to decide I'm visiting planet x today or tomorrow
@TimeOutForMe ....religion is the practice of not dealing with those feelings...religion is building a wall around yourself to insulate yourself from reality......I too am "curious " ...to a fault!....that said I've made the opportunity to do my bucket list many times over!!.....the last time I was in your area I was in mossel bay swimming with great white sharks!..as soon as this covid mess is over I'm back!!!
@Redneckliberal and since I have not had a religion since my teens, I remain open-minded and curious. Please let me know when you're here. We have PM'd before and should you wish to spend a few days in johannesburg, before going back home you're most welcome. You should consider doing photographs on the whales on another trip. They pass that side for more than six month's while you're shooting the great whites. Gordon's Bay, Hermanus, Shelley Beach, Britannia Bay. ...on the same Garden Route as Mossel Bay. I've got some great pics of the whales from Britannia Bay/Beach I'll pm them to you.
@TimeOutForMe thanks again so much!!!...ive done the whales several times at Mboiti while filming the sardine run...they are spectacular!!!...when covid allows ill be there!!!
@Redneckliberal the sardine run is spectacular. Nature's best. Yes when travel is relaxed and we've got money again
I think the idea of immortality is that you are impervious to injuries as well. At least, that is always how I understood it. Otherwise, how can you expect to remain alive indefinitely?
The Q in Star Trek are all knowing and all powerful, but also all bored. This is somewhat similar to the Ancients in Stargate.
This is a concept that has both been explored quite a bit and yet not enough.
Have you seen The Good Place? This series explores a version of the afterlife that I love to discuss with all theists. Unfortunately, the afterlife is so central to their way of thinking they can't fathom the concept of never ending existence. They always describe the afterlife as some amazing experience, but don't know how to respond when I ask what their existence will be like a trillion years from now. Though they certainly can be forgiven for not getting their evolved human brain to grasp a timeframe much greater than 100 years.
Then there's the potentially real concept of conquering both disease and aging such that we might live for hundreds of years. Bicentennial Man comes to mind here though there have been many stories exploring this idea. Much like The Good Place, the writers do tend to take their characters to a state of conclusion where they are ready to end their existence.
For me, if anyone reading is curious, I like the thought of going out on my own terms after having time to explore and learn. As long as new experiences and more knowledge remains part of our existence, I could see myself hanging around. This is especially true in that I believe when our brains die, our conscienceness cease to exist and therefore so do we.
I highly recommend The Good Place. Don't be turned off by the "afterlife" theme, it is about so much more than that. The writers practically rake pop culture over the coals and provide many fun and clever plot twists. Some episodes are near masterpieces, such as the one with Stephen Merchant (Season 3, Episode 10). The show did not offend my agnostic sensibilities in the least and the ending was touchingly poignant.