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Why do you identify as being agnostic? Are you agnostic about unicorns, fairies and the gods of other cultures? What is the evidence that leads you to agnosticism?

waitingforgodo 8 June 19
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8

I identify as atheist, but am not offended at being referred to as agnostic. Agnosticism is a type of atheism.

Deb57 Level 8 June 19, 2021

think so, huh? It’s not possible to be a gnostic atheist, iyo?

@bbyrd009 no, that’s absurd.

@Mvtt well that depends on what definition of gnostic you are using, i guess. Best of luck to you

@bbyrd009 I didn't say anything was not possible. It is possible for there to be a spectrum between belief and disbelief. Thinking in absolutes makes us wrong most of the time. Agnosticism means there is doubt. Doubt is not synonymous with belief. It's not rocket science.

@Deb57 “agnosticism means there is doubt” is an absolute statement though, right? Which i don’t mean that im disagreeing, agnosticism might kind of mean that, sure, although im not sure that that is the best definition...”doubt is not synonymous with belief” another absolute statement, and i gotta ask why not? Doesn’t “belief” infer “something i think is true, but might possibly not be true?” if only, right

It’s not rocket science, but there does seem to be like two definitions for every term, huh? We say “belief” but they are most often really “absolute truths” like you have described, and etc. Iow we are all basically speaking in tongues i guess

you don’t consider yourself a gnostic, but you just made five gnostic statements there, see

@bbyrd009 I don't know if you're agnostic, and frankly I don't care. It's clear that you're antagonistic, though. If it makes you feel better to label me for having opinions, then knock yourself out.

@Deb57 yes, i still regress into Gnosticism sometimes i guess, but im not meaning to be antagonistic, at least per se. I guess maybe it comes across that way? But regardless, imo that would be a failing on my part, ok; as i said, i might even agree with your gnostic statements, in a certain context, but they are basically self-labeling, as they are...not stated as opinions, but statements of fact, “this is that, that is this,” no qualifiers, see? Which im not meaning to say “bad” necessarily, but that any new information on the matter now cannot be assimilated, and will be labeled “antagonistic”

A point is that they are not stated/written as opinions, but as statements of fact, which label themselves, more or less; my choices now are to agree (and by implication, “be friends” ) or disagree, with the opposite effect, which we see manifesting, i guess bc i suck at signaling that as far as im concerned we can disagree and still be friends? 🙂

Why does any disagreement now mean that we are automatically enemies? I think we are trained into this via being taught to reason from the Hegelian dialectic, wherein i am now framed as “opposition” maybe?

Anyway, my reservations @ “doubt” are bc imo doubt is usually just another form of belief? Believing the opposite thing? So, while i am possibly the worst person for you to hear this from, as you are now defensive where i am concerned and will naturally reject everything i suggest, i mainly meant to forward a definition of gnostic/agnostic that is more functional, more to the point, which has nothing to do with “God” per se, since of course no one knows whether there is a “God” or not

And my apologies if that up there seems antagonistic to you, ok; i actually thought i was agreeing with you at many points, and unfortunately i am still blind to what may have bothered you up there. And i can’t move on until i get that part i guess, so now im pissed lol

7

I'm agnostic because I have no knowledge of any gods existing. I'm atheist because I believe in zero gods, due to a lack of evidence.

even xeno, wow. So then, who does have knowledge of any gods existing, xeno?

@bbyrd009 No one has been able to prove there is a god. I doubt anyone has any knowledge of any gods existing.

@xenoview boo ya
so then a definition of agnostic as "doesnt know if there is a God or not" is patently shit on its face then, right

@bbyrd009 Do you have any knowledge of a god existing?

@xenoview you're answering a question with a question now, how come?
fuck what i know or don't know, that was not the point

does everything real require that we have "objective evidence" of it?
(yes, this is a trick question)

@bbyrd009 The way you dodge questions, makes me think your a troll.

@xenoview ok. ty

6

To the subject of religion, I have a lack of belief. That's all I have to say about myself. I don't need to label myself as anything.

Ryo1 Level 8 June 19, 2021
6

I identify as an agnostic atheist, and a board church sceptic. Because I see no reason to believe in absolutes, and consider doubt as the main feature of honesty.

5

I identify as a humanist of the secular variety. Who cares what I don’t believe in? It’s more important what I do believe in.

5

Religion is just stupid. Ridiculous, boring.

5

I do not identify myself as anything. Hate labels.

5

I 'identify as agnostic' in situations where people seem uncomfortable discussing atheism.

I read a thought from Greta Christina many years ago that represents my thoughts on the issue well. I'm paraphrasing from memory here so I apologize for inaccuracies in the specific wording.

Throughout history we thought that many effects had supernatural causes -- the sun was Apollo carrying a lamp across the sky, thunder was dwarves bowling in the mountains, whatever. But as we looked at things more closely, we found secular explanations for things to replace the previous fantasies.

But how many times has it gone the other direction? 'I used to think there was a secular explanation for an effect but now I realize it was caused by that god over there, or the rabbit's foot in my pocket, or the spell I cast.' -- Exactly Zero .

As human ignorance reduces, so too does the influence of the supernatural including gods.

RichCC Level 8 June 19, 2021

Reminds me of the comment about the God Of The Gaps. The gaps are getting smaller all the time, your god keeps shrinking, but never seems to grow back.

Would that it were so. ........... I can remenber being a kid on the streets of yonkers, in 1949, thinking that with the growth of modern science,there's no way this religion nonsense could last more than another 20 or 30 years

@holdenc98

You're right of course. Religion has a massive following and no motivation to go anywhere in the foreseeable future.
I don't believe in the progress fairy either -- science won't eventually solve all our problems.

We'll just have to go on the best way we can -- as unpleasant a statement as that is. Ha, ha, I guess.

You just basically paraphrased the whole point of the Bible, believe it or not

@RichCC Hmm i would say that religion is coming apart at the seams as we watch? Interesting

4

For me, it is the unknown that leads me to identify as agnostic. Unicorns and fairies are well enough defined that we could identified them if they turn out to be real. But since we have no evidence of them, we have no reason to believe they exist. The same is true of God's from all sorts. They are defined well enough we could identify them if evidense is found for their existence. But a God could exist in a form we are not yet able to define. So, for me, agnostism isn't about any or all God's as defined, but a God that has yet to be understood. I have heard others describe themselves in this same way and consider themselves atheists, and I prefer agnostism.

4

Agnostic? I identify as God. I exist, damn you 😡

4

I am agnostic because I am open to all probabilities.

I would say the same thing, only substitute "possibilities".

@Organist1 LOL, I was going to say possibilities but, I thought probabilities would better describe my thoughts on the matter.

@MrDragon No you just could not remember how to spell it. True ? LOL

@Fernapple No, I look at it like this, I have never seen a unicorn, I have seen pictures of them, and I have never seen the pyramids of Gesa but I have seen pictures of them, so, there is a probability there. Yes?

@MrDragon You are very wise.

@MrDragon Where did you see a picture of a unicorn? It is quite possible that I would bet it's not probable you saw a picture of a unicorn. 😝

@JeffMurray on the internet, where else? It's amazing what you can find on the internet. lol

3

I am not agnostic. I am gnostic that nobody has ever produced any falsifiable evidence to support the existence claims of any those entities.

is there not an atheist site that you would be more comfortable maybe?

@bbyrd009 I enjoy the company here.

@bbyrd009 this is NOT an agnostic site. The domain name is just called that. There are more atheists on this site than agnostics, certainly last time I looked. It's a recurring and annoying theme of agnostics on this site that it's really an agnostic site and wouldn't you atheists be happy elsewhere. No. I have never liked the name of the site, but put up with it to engage with the non religious, which sometimes includes agnostics, though I've learnt to take this term with a grain of salt.

3

I don't "identify" as Agnostic. I proclaim I am an Atheist.

2

I don't. I'm am atheist to my back teeth. Curious that you ask 'what evidence' leads to the agnostic position. From what I can make out, agnosticism means 'I don't know...I'm not sure." Hardly an evidence based position. For the atheist, the total lack of evidence leads inexorably to a rejection of all supernatural nonsense, including religion.

2

I'm not waiting for any gods. I found out they are all phony and they just want to bully you and burn you if you do not like them.

2

My primary identity is nullifidian: one who has no faith or religious belief. If someone wants to call me an atheist or an agnostic, such labels don’t concern me as I am comfortable wearing both.

You Lost me at "both".... but Good for you!

2

How are you defining “agnostic” there? Bc no one actually knows if there is a God or not, right?
I tell you that the definition has been dumbed down now, to conceal the real discussion.

“crickets”

2

My dictionary (Shorter O.E.D. ) has two definitions concerning atheism. It says that atheism means "without god" and an atheist is "someone who denies or disbelieves the existence of a god". It doesn't seem to include the state of believing there is no god. This seems to narrow the gap between atheism and agnosticism.
As I really can't imagine that there is a god, have never been offered convincing proof that a god exists, but can't see way to prove that there are no gods, I remain agnostic about the whole subject but atheistic in being without a god.

My gardener is coming to convert the bottom of my outdoor space into a wildflower garden soon so perhaps I'll spot some fairies before the autumn. 😉

“an atheist is "someone who denies or disbelieves the existence of a god". It doesn't seem to include the state of believing there is no god”

I’d love to know the difference? Bc no offense but what im hearing right now is “atheists can be just as big a hypocrites as fundamentals”

@bbyrd009 Hi, yes, thanks, it does my head in. So, if denial is spoken, then it may not reflect belief. (Probably some discussion here ) and "disbelief" is not given in my dictionary as a belief in the negative case, but simply as lack of belief in the positive case.
It is possible that different dictionaries give different or slightly different meanings to some words, as I get the impression that some people regard the word "atheist " to mean someone who believes that there are no gods - an actual belief.
I hope this clears up my point of view

2

What led me to agnosticism was the lack of evidence either way. I'm more inclined to the non-existence of a deity but I don't think there's any evidence.

2

That is street epistemology I believe. Lol

emphasis on the lol?

2

because "look around!"

there must be something responsible for the beauty 🙂

Isn't beauty in the eye of the beholder? Beauty to a dung beetle ...

@RussRAB i was being facetious

and yes it absolutely is u r right

@HeAdAkE - I never doubted it, and I couldn't resist. 😁

@HeAdAkE - I can't tell you how many times I've heard Christians make this kind of argument as proof of their God. No doubt you have too.

@RussRAB its exactly what i sourced my material from 😛

tell me this : when somebody says "ill pray for you" do it really mean "fuck u?"

couldnt resist as well, i love to use swears as often as applicable 🙂

Natural beauty does not necessitate a supernatural origin. Take yourself, for example.

2

Because I honestly do not know, I do not know anybody who has a firm answer based on facts.🤔 And to be perfectly honest it does not matter that much to me when it's over it's over I'm here now I'm going to live now. To me it's way too much to do about nothing. 😁

2

I suppose I'm agnostic about those things too, and atheist about all of them. If you want to consider theoretical degrees of agnosticism, I guess I feel there's a greater degree of certainty about unicorns and faeries because there's no currently-unknown information they can fill the gap for and they are purported to be on Earth and visible. But then as soon as you add parameters to the concept of god (like using the Christian conception of god) the tables flip and it becomes more possible for unicorns to have existed because the Christian conception of god is a logical impossibility.

Unicorns do exist , but they're built more like a tank than a weightless horse . We call them rhinosaurs

@Cast1es If you go by the old testament desription, it is so obvious that they are refering to rhinos, that you wonder how anyone could think anything else.

1

I don’t identify as agnostic. I identify as Robin. If any one ask me about the existence of god, then I may use the word ‘agnostic’.

No evidence lead me to agnosticism.

1

To claim knowledge or understanding from the acquisition of facts and information of the supernatural- is absurd, and or delusional.

Mvtt Level 7 June 21, 2021
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