@Bobby9 Then try this one. If the masses have poverty it must be that the rich have some of their money. If the masses all live in poverty how would it be that a top percentage had wealth in the first place? The poor get poorer and the rich get richer.

@Bobby9 I'll try facts if you remove your head from Donald's ass. Notice that you are so ready to come down hard on me and my words involve another word which is "IF." I find that IF is a big word for supposed situations.

@Bobby9 In no way did I say or imply that wealth is always stolen. You forgot my "IF" word in my posting. What is the point? OK, we said it so why are we whipping a dead horse?

@Bobby9 Just forget it and let's stop. Pretend you have won an argument.

@Bobby9 How is that poverty for the masses working out for you, Bobby?

@Bobby9 I'm done Bobby. Quit bro, go!

The entire economic system is built on the backs and the misery of the poor. Most of us would not eat if migrant laborers didn't work for farms in horrifying conditions and for little to no pay. Working people do everything from stocking your groceries to educating/ watching your children and so much more. Most of us cannot afford the basic neccesities of life and continue to have our lives eaten up by 70 hour work weeks so that the wealthy can live easy lives and have healthy returns on their investments. It isn't just greedy landlords, almost anyone who lives comfortably in this country does so at the expense of countless low paid workers. Then we get to see ourselves painted as feckless "takers" who are lazy and stupid in popular media and opinion.

@OpposingOpposum ,
the higher income people should do something to address this ridiculous wealth/income disparity. if they don't they'll live to regret it.
they could end up like the professional/high income people in argentina who were ground down to a lower middle income level.

@Bobby9 , have you ever heard the term "rich as an argentinian"--probably not.
your response reveals your ignorance.

So “I”... can “feel better than” (you).

SAD. Very primitive and not mentally evolved.

Let's not forget "wars". If the profit were taken out of war...there very likely would be fewer of them. With the except of, I might imagine, religious wars.

In High school we studied Feudalism. I asked the teacher how people got to be serfs. The answer was something about economic necessity. The image that sticks in my mind is: a master of cerimonies saying, " Raise your hand if you want to be a King; How about a Baron?" and so on. When he got to serf every hand went up.

I hate to burst your bubble but money has become the god of choice for many Americans and you see where that has gotten us. If you did not make your money growing food for the masses, working as a civil servant, etc...then chances are it was made off the back of somebody else. Rents here in western NC are sky high, not because property is inherently worth more but because people with money are moving here in droves and buying it all up which is driving up the cost for all of us. Also, capitalism is evil.

@ReadyforaChange - I hate to bust your bubble, but you are not correct, not in my case. You do not know me, and should not ASSume you know anything about me. Well, save for your biases giving you information that is not correct, you have nothing from which to form your opinion. My money was earned by working hard, working smart, limiting my investments in companies I felt were moral, ethical, and good. With considerate management, and not abusing any privileges the money was NOT earned at anyone else's expense. Your generalizations are rude and arrogant. Capitalism is not evil, but I will agree that there certainly are a lot of evil-minded capitalists. To hate all people in a demograph is truly bigotry. And it seems fairly universal that the so-called "have-not" people hate the "have" people, without any logic. (How's that for a bias??)

@Rustee Okay you win...coz you KNOW you're right and I'm wrong. That's okay...we are both entitled to our own opinion. You said that it seems that some people assume that "ALL people with money are somehow evil", on the contrary, I don't necessarily think wealthy people are evil, but I think lots of people with money are arrogant assholes. You are kind of proving my point.
Also, FYI, YOU ASSume (real mature lady) that I could give two shits about what you think. You ASSume wrong my dear. Thanks for playing.

@ReadyforaChange - Oh? Are we playing a game?? Or are we discussing a subject? There is no "win", it is a discussion; at least that was my mind-set as I entered into the situation.

"Seems" is the important word to notice as far as my assumption that people with money are evil; a qualifier, if you will. I am not proving your point at all!

I will politely overlook that you seem to have called me an “arrogant asshole”, although I do not consider myself as such. I used to be married to one, and people in his family could be termed as such, so I definitely recognize the behavior & attitude. I probably could be arrogant or “asshole-ish” if pushed, but that isn’t very sportsmanlike, is it? I endeavor to have a verbal intercourse without resorting to rudeness. At least unless pushed by like behavior. Name-calling is so immature, especially with such crude names...

You actually must give “two shits” what I think (a real mature descriptive, RFAC. Sorry, I cannot call you a lady.), or you would not have engaged yet again. There was nothing to assume, your actions explained that you do care, however slightly.

I KNOW that I am right about myself, but thank you for conceding that point, even if grudgingly! Yes, we are indeed entitled to our opinions. It just frustrates me when some people’s opinions are based upon their biases, or erroneous information.

There are also many business people who do treat their employees well.
People have to keep in mind that they are also competing against other similar
businesses, some of who DON'T treat their employees well. Many people are price
conscious.

@think-freely - Thank you, yes, some business people CARE about their employees and their product, and are caring and careful with all aspects of their business. I am price-conscious to a certain point, but I would rather pay more for products or services from businesses in the USA, or who treat their employees well.

@Rustee Wow you REALLY love to hear yourself talk don't you? I am SO blocking your arrogant, irritating know-it-all ARSE RIGHT NOW. Buh BYE

Well, dang, ReadyforaChange deleted her comments. That is rather interesting, and I wonder why!

This discussion saddens me! I no longer have anything to do with Face book because discussions there tend to degenerate in this kind of rancor.

In my experience small business owners are usually scrupulously honest, hard working and generous. Too often they are taken advantage of by corporations (Just like the opressed workers.) Let the independent business people unite with the poor and squeeze the oligarchs and their corporations..

@ReadyforaChange As a member of White Privilege and resident of an affluent area, I could write a book about how people shoot themselves in the financial foot....over and over and over again.
1st consideration is that they DO NOT care about money, paying any bills, budgeting, prioritizing work.
Yes, being poor IS a choice for them. And it is shocking how much of it is a CONSCIOUS choice.
#2) You could "give" all the money some people want , and then give them more. Come back and visit them in 3 years....see what they have left of it. And see what bad habits all of that money has fixed

I think in any power-imbalanced economic system, there will be haves and have nots. That's not the point though, is it? "Poverty will always exist" isn't quite true either. But to jump from that to "poverty isn't necessarily a bad thing either" because there are always going to someone poorer, is a big jump. You are talking about relative wealth inequalities. Replace "poverty" with "relative wealth inequalities" I would totally agree with you, but then the statements would be almost meaningless.

How do we define poverty? Is there a point where the relative "wealth inequalities" reach such a stretching point so as to give rise to the terms like "abject poverty" or "obscene wealth"?

According to Marxian theory, in capitalism, there is a built-in tendency for the "concentration" of wealth, that is, the relative inequalities would become greater and greater. This isn't a static model where simply a wide "income diversity" exists, but a dynamic model where it becomes worse and worse and worse. It was Marx's criticism that this was not a bug in the system, but a feature.

But we aren't simply talking about relative "income diversity." We are talking about the state of these "diversity" that the quantitative difference begins to manifest in qualitative differences. That is, it isn't just poverty, but abject poverty. It isn't just wealth, but obscene wealth.

You may be right that this tendency of pure capitalism can be ameliorated, regulated and controlled by the "mixed economy" of capitalism light. But we are long ways from that in this country. We are long ways from that, in part because of the belief "hey, at least they are not as bad as the poor people in other countries."

@KenChang Well said.

@KenChang I think we actually agree. As I said poverty will always exist in a capitalist system. I was specifically talking about capitalism. I'm sorry if that wasnt clear.

I think that because we have a competitive economic structure we are obliged to have social safety net and services at the very least. This is of course a minimalist point of view because huge sweeping changes will likely never happen without a bloody revolution, so I promote incremental changes.

@KenChang the one area where I think Marx truly excelled was picking apart the flaws in capitalism.

But does capitalism mean a rigged system? I'm talking about actively not allowing large groups of people to acquire wealth thru discrimination. A lot of the capital wealth in this country has been build on the backs of the poor. Is that just the collateral damage of capitalism?

I read the book a few years ago, I don't remember it as being depressing because there were some "happy endings." It is a really good look at how obstacles are placed in the way of financially troubled people to keep them down, and what can be done about it.

@HippieChick58 That's encouraging. I think I'll take a look then.