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51 8

If you had to kill your own meat would you?

I am curious how many people would be vegan or vegetarian, if they had to slaughter their own meat, or watch it be killed? I know it doesn’t bother everyone. I have family that hunts, skins, and cleans their kill. I also do not preach to those who choose to eat meat. It’s your life, live it how you want. I do think many people choose to ignore the actual process of meat getting to the store, all cleaned up and packaged neatly. I also wonder for those who hunt yet claim to love animals, how does that go hand in hand? I’m not judging, I really am curious. Aberham Twerski said this regarding love: “‘Young man. Why are you eating that fish?’ The young mans says, ‘Because I love fish.’ He says, ‘Oh. You love the fish. That’s why you took it out of the water and killed it and boiled it.’ He says, ‘Don’t tell me you love the fish. You love yourself, and because the fish tastes good to you; therefore, you took it out of the water and killed it and boiled it.’

BohoHeathen 8 Sep 10

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51 comments

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0

Just look at as you are giving the animal mercy from beeing killed in some other horrific manner.

8

I practice field to table regularly. I accept the moral obligations that come with it and I do NOT shirk from those obligations. That means I take only sure shots that are quick and lethal. Then that means I go as absolutely far as I can to use every bit of the animal that I can and what I cannot make use of goes back to the forest where it belongs. I even save the marginally edible scrap to make dog treats, much to my dog's everloving joy.

Also, I recently switched to using all non-toxic lead free ammunition. I have read hundreds of peer reviewed scientific papers on the subject and the evidence is clear that residual lead in the gutpile is a source of lead poisoning in raptors, particularly eagles.

And this is directly attributable to being a committed Rooseveltian conservationist that agrees with the North American Wildlife Conservation Model.

8

I'd kill a bologna in a second.

How could you!! 😉

@BeeHappy drown it in mustard.

@hankster lol, that's one way. Or burn it at the stake... oh, I mean pan.

6

Yeah I think so, I’d still like to get into hunting. I question whether Id have the stomach for it at first but I’d rather hunt and fish than patronize large scale agriculture. If you’re curious about how someone can love animals yet still hunt you should check out the series Meateater on netflix. It’s a great, unusually smart hunting/cooking show by Steve Renella. I don’t remember anything super graphic in it, although it’s bound to be a sensitive topic. He really understands conservationism, and at the very least undoubtedly has a great respect for animals and indigenous people, with whom he hunts and fishes. It’s about realizing that we’re a part of the food chain, wildlife doesn’t manage itself, and there is a sustainable, ethical way to eat meat by working hard for it, taking no more than you need, and taking personal responsibility for your part in the food chain.

The way I look at it is: life eats life. Even large scale vegetable farming necessitates pesticides, fertilizers, huge damage to the environment, and grain harvesters are constantly sucking up fawns and ground nesting animals. The only way to get around causing death by your diet is to do all your organic farming yourself and grow a years worth of vegetables every summer. It’s not practical for everyone just like hunting isn’t practical for everyone, but the more of either and both any of us can do, the better.

Deer and elk are beautiful animals, but almost nothing has the privilege of dying of old age or natural causes in the wild. They mostly die by starvation, freezing, or torn apart asshole first by wolves (yes, really). All of which are obviously slower processes than an animal lover would like. If one can die at a mature age, after it’s had a chance to breed, by a bullet or arrow, and sustain a discerning person for months if not most of the year, keeping them from giving business to the awful cruelties of large scale slaughterhouses, that’s about the best outcome possible for the planet and everyone involved. I try not to harm any living thing I don’t have to, with the exception of parasites. But if I was killing for food and wasting nothing I’d feel morally better than I do going to McDonald’s for sure.

That is a very thoughtful response.

There are communities literally sprouting up all over, IE: Newark, N.J. where successful experimental new forms of hydroponics are growing fine-tuned essential veggies, even hardy leaf lettuces with nutrient compounds from natural sources while using about one-third of the water via terrace and trellises farming. Here is only ONE book of many which document this fairly new phenomenon of VERTICAL FARMING:

[amazon.com]

Most Nutritionists regard veggies as essential even within the bounds of any form of a PALEO preference based on one's blood type.

@LetzGetReal yeah for sure, I’d never try to go straight carnivore. The veggies and fruit for dessert should be the highlight of most meals and Americans could stand to eat less meat than we do. I think if I hunted for it myself it would also be more precious and sparsely used. Ideally I’d like to get my own garden running too, if not with hydro methods then with sustainable food jungle methods, planting crops that compliment each other. Beans squash and corn go great together from what I’ve read. The native Americans planted them in combination; the beans grow up the corn and the squash grows along their base. I don’t remember the specifics but all 3 releases some nitrates or other nutrients that the other needs, they all make each other thrive. If everyone who has a yard or community space planted a small garden (you can even plant in hay bales for an easily broken down raised planting bed) the world would be a better place.

@Wurlitzer Vertical gardening is the newest concept to check out too; it is suitable for urban environments.

6

Grew up hunting and fishing on a farm. Taught to butcher cows, chickens, and deer from a young age. Chose being a vegan for health, environmental concerns and the way that farms currently raise animals with no dignity and much cruelty. When we raised animals on our farm they had good lives up until the end... Probably wouldn't eat meat today even if corporate farms raised animals humanely.

6

I would only do it if I needed food. Not for sport

6

Yes, I would and have. I lived on a farm for many years and grew up in the country where we hunted and fished and we cleaned and cooked our own meat regularly. It's the cycle of life for all living things, we live, we die and sometimes we are eaten by a predator. I have no problem with it.

What I do have a problem with is cruelty to animals under your charge during their life. Our animals had excellent care, food and treatment. They were fed before anyone else, had clean living conditions and never abused. Much better than many humans are raised.

@BohoHeathen Then you must have never experienced a less than pleasant quality of life. Quality of life is very important. Take the dogs and cats confiscated from puppy mills where they are virtually tortured for neglect. I would say a life with quality of care is much better than a life of tortured neglect. Or something more relevant to humans.... slavery of old or even the child sex trafficking currently. Would you say their quality of life is irrelevant simply because eventually they will die, as we all do?

When death is inevitable to all, quality of life is all there is.

@BohoHeathen Oh, well, I never called their death humane or better, only their treatment in life. So not sure what your point was in your statement. However, death can be humane, if it's quick and not cruelly done to cause added pain and suffering. I would much rather drown than a long gruesome cancer death. It can also be quiet and peaceful. Violence is not necessary. But I'm sure you won't see that as though you claim to make no judgments I feel that you are because of things like "selfish reasons".

That's okay, you're POV is yours and mine is mine. I'm okay that they don't agree.

@BohoHeathen We all die, one way or another.

When the animal kingdom is studied, more is comprehended.

@BohoHeathen This one, in particular, is edgy again in my view on judgmental...

@BohoHeathen, @NoPlanetB PRECISELY, TY NoPlanetB

5

It would be difficult for me.

It takes skill, equipment and a sharp knife to hang upside down a cow by it's hind Achilles tendon and slit it's throat to bleed to death remove the hide for shoes and furniture....chill down to 33°F and wait for USDA INSPECTION

5

Can't and won't. I know people who do but not me.

5

Probably not...
A stray chicken found me and I actually feel guilty if I eat chicken now... lol

@BohoHeathen it's TRUE. Lol

5

Did this, when I first left the army hunted food until I got back to work, my family ate wild game and thrived

5

I have hunted and fished. I made a point of eating or trying to eat whatever animal or fish I took. First, I was not really good at either, so no creatures went extinct while I was hunting/gathering. Second, cleaning the catch was not fun, but fortunately I never killed a large animal like a dear or bear. Third, I could never be a farmer and raise animals to be slaughtered, but then I could never be a boxer or a surgeon either. Cutting live flesh is not something I would do willingly. Fourth, my rationalizing for eating meat is that putting that meat on the table is employment and income for thousands of people. Farm kids are lovingly raising animals for slaughter because it is the life they were brought up in. And millions of animals would never be born at all if it wasn’t for the food industry.
I realize the corporate farming and slaughtering is not pleasant, I have been inside chicken processing plants. But then vegetable farming on the corporate scale often mistreats humans in the process of growing those vegetables. But there would be no other way to feed our exploding population with mom and pop farms. They are a luxury few can afford, and I want to grow my own vegetables about as much as I want to hunt my own meat! 😊

I loved growing vegetables. But it was a very very small garden. 🙂

Aquaponics is the way to go for food production.

5

Posting slaughterhouse videos could get me in trouble for posting offensive material. Showing factory farms would turn stomachs.

I saw a movie, "Earthlings" that put me off of meat. My cousin became vegan after watching it. It's on Vimeo and YouTube. What I'm saying is, you're right.

5

Society in the UK dosen't hunt often. We but from supermarkets or butchers. We are a mostly urban society and many have forgot where meat comes from. In education small children appear reviled at the idea their chicken nuggets came from a bird, burgers from a cow, bacon from a pig and so on. Many seem to think that pork sausages are made in a factory from stuff, not thinking that it was once a living animal or two.
Then milk, or cow juice as I often wind kids up with. Squeeze an orange, what do you get? Orange juice, squeeze a cow - cow juice.
All complex life kills and consumes to live. Humans are a hunter species.

4

I think there would be many more vegetarians if everyone had to be involved in the killing and butchery of the animals they eat.
It is so easy to go to the supermarket and buy a plastic wrapped joint and I doubt if many people give a thought as to the living animal it originally was part of.
I try to avoid cheap chicken and pork because of the conditions the animals are kept in.
Beef here is mainly from grass fed animals that lead a reasonable life before being slaughtered but having driven past feedlots in the USA where cattle are kept in bare earth pens and pumped full of antibiotics that is a totally different thing.
We have evolved as omnivores but many of us eat far too much meat which makes us ill but to me veganism is too extreme and a step too far

Great succinct explanation.TY

4

Yes.

And if you've ever seen how animals kill their prey, hunting is very civilized by comparison.

Hunting to eat is civilized verses for a trophy, indeed. ~

4

Humans are omnivores. When you grow up in a poor rural environment, you need the protein from game, fish and animals you raise to provide the protein you need to survive. Animals killing animals is a part of nature. Slaughtering huge numbers of animals is not. But, being completely a vegan is not a part of nature for humans.

4

If born 200 years ago, I would be moving through the digestive system of wolves.

Very sad thought

As a person who needs glasses I would definitely be somebody's meal.

4
4

I have, and will do again, hunted. Every thing from Duck, Pheasant, to Deer. And I also fish, and have Crabbed.
Back in the day I was a Chef at a few different places over the years. So I've learned every thing from hunting to serving dinner.
It's a bit unrealistic to say that every one should kill, and carve an animal to food, even though it would be a good idea. yet It is also unrealistic to say that humans should never kill another animal as well. To be honest I see both sides, mostly because I am also a huge animal lover.
Meh I'm probably talking in circles here. But I can say one thing, Humans as we are at this point of evolution are Omnivores. we can try to deny that fact, but we just can't get the nutrition we need with out proteins, and other than animals, proteins are hard to come by.
JMHO.

@BohoHeathen There is scientific and Nutritional controversy about this based on years of controlled studies. I think people also vary in their dietary needs.

@LetzGetReal I have to agree. And it is more than inconclusive due to many giving data on both sides of the fence that are fairly biased. I could be wrong, but I happen to lean on the side of that humans can't get the nutrients from only plants.

@LetzGetReal, @BohoHeathen I kind of get where you are going with that. but think about this. The needs of Deer, cows, ducks, etc, is vastly different than the needs of humans. Imagine, if you will, trying to live on eating grass your whole life. I really doubt that any human could, yet many other mammals do just that.

@TristanNuvo It simply does not scientifically, translate.

@TristanNuvo I agree after 50 plus years of researching nutrition, and at the same time, Hemp is the purest, most concentrated form of protein which is not involved in these studies...

And there are other, more esoteric and "superfoods" today plus what is currently being developed. Some of it is indeed Junk Science, so one needs to do their homework if so inclined.

I have basically, pretty much changed my diet every ten years, our bodies change. And we do have more choices than we did in the past decades.

Eating is very primal, one will most likely go with their gut, pardon the double entendre! 😉

4

i don't want to be around if that is what it comes to. i cannot imagine the chaos. i try to accommodate my kids evolving views and food choices. i figure they are educating themselves on the ecology and idealistic, why crush it with mandatory hamburger. i do this while lying to myself that i could do it if i had to all the while knowing the involuntary gagging at slaughter training would be to the point of certain failure if not hemorrhage. i believe i could help with the clean and dress, but the kill? that i would have wished i was taught as a boy by my dad. if i had to figure it out now? would be tough. i am eating less meat because of my kids choices. but sometimes i eat the steak right in front of them.

That not being around, sounds noble, but one can change their mind. Dying from starvation is very intense for most people. I have been on a hunger strike for a cause, it was hell.

I don't see that the world has to be in "chaos" for a drastic mindset change where smaller ranchers and fisheries provide flesh-eating as a kind of delicacy rather than the vast amounts of meats and fast foods people consume without even thinking about it. Do you?

@LetzGetReal nah. i was more in the mindset that the food supply was somehow interrupted and we all had to fend for ourselves. noble? more like chickenshit. i don't have an arsenal. would make it tough for me to one bag meat from under the couch, two... holy shit can you imagine the chaos? and me without an arsenal? and worse... meat?!

that is what i meant.

kidding aside, i am listening to my children and in the process of accomodation am making better choices. reading labels. healthier choices? they'll publish what i've been eating that has been killing me two years from now even if i change it anyway, so i am going to enjoy something in life. one of my choices may be to hunt. not sure. i like meat a lot. my kids are pretty damn persuasive. the argument the kid is using is all encompassing from treatment to climate to health... if it comes down to bambi or tofu? i might learn to set a snare. i now know a bean patty recipe. doesn't taste a damn thing like meat, but its got protein in it, and its reasonably burger shaped. not sure which causes more human gas - red meat or beans, but we're experimenting.

i have never engaged a person that undertook a hunger strike. i imagine starving to death sucks.

my view of nature allows me to eat meat. truthfully, the canines in my mouth are really all about i need. i also don't think my eating less or none is a drop in the bucket. i doubt my local butcher notes it. well other than they probably mine the data off of my credit card, but he's not cutting less meat.

@larsatrg You have a delightful way of communicating, serious info with a touch of humor, I love it. I hope you are not offended by my reactions or comments.

And It sounds like you have wonderfully aware, compassionate children in which you must have had an influence in raising, I applaud you on this plus your candor. TY!

@LetzGetReal thanks. that is much nicer than confusing, negative, wordy, self rightous windbag. and none inferred. why did you mean offense? 🙂

they're good kids. proud of them. it is what i am thinking. that is what i am going for anyway. might have to work on the filter a little, but steaming toward crotchety old man anyway. might as well get in the practice.

@larsatrg Well, you stated, "seriously" and I still used the humor emoticon. No big deal. You are still putting a smile on this face.

I take the impression, right ot wrong-- the undertone of this post entails more than reaching for any fresh info.

Again, am not big on guilt... Over and out on that lack of confluence. 🤓

Be well and I trust your children just might help develop a better planet despite your spearing a steak now and then. 😉

4

I was involved in the annual slaughter of pigs. I have now learned enough of nutriotion that I do not have to slaughter pigs anymore, or goats, cows and sheep and chickens. So no,Iwould not.

Pigs are smart as dogs, some are more intelligent than, plus their organs are used as transplants because they are more readily accepted not rejected by human bodies over more closely related primates... Something to be reexamined for sure.

The industry of large scale slaughter is a horror show, indeed. TY for your first-hand comment, I have been around this, too in West Va when I lived there for years...

4

Yes I would, and I have no problem with eating road kill..yes I can dress a kill (skin & gut)..I also have no problem with fishing..or trapping (rabbit, squirrels)..I would do whatever needed to stay alive..obviously I'm an omnivore..hunting for food and loving an animal(s) are separate needs..one is survival the other companionship..I wouldn't kill to consume endangered species..

4

I live on 12 acres beside a river for a reason. I don't hunt, but I shoot targets. But if I had to, my freezer would be filled with Deer, bear, turkey and whatever else might be good. I catch fish fresh so I wouldn't freeze them.

4

I have. We raised chickens. I have fished.

4

Yes. That said not as often, as it is very messy.

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