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It's not the when, it's the why. There was a recent discussion about if sex on the first date could lead to a good relationship.(hell yes!) With both my wives, we were both all in from the start. This is our romantic adventure, we were fucking like crazy and sharing our deepest thoughts and dreams. Fortune favors the bold, but I don't mind waiting for a woman who needs some time to decide or process her feelings. What has bothered me is someone who withholds sex or approval to gain the upper hand in the relationship, it's objectifying and when it has happened I was just done.

Buttercup 8 May 22
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i time yes it led to 3 children however i think it like many things won't make much difference either way

weeman Level 7 July 19, 2018

I found it to be true that while is really important it's not going to make anybody stay, and it's not going to make anybody leave

Kojaksmom Level 8 May 27, 2018

Pretty much my take too, arranged marriages have a good success rate even with perfect strangers and they obviously don't wait to see if they're compatible.


I have posted this before but will do it again for the newcomers. I saw a pair of his and hers T-shirts. His said: "Just because I had sex with you doesn't mean I love you" and hers said: Just because I love you doesn't mean I will have sex with you". When it comes to sex women and men are normally different in what they are looking for.

JackPedigo Level 9 May 23, 2018

Right on the button @Buttercup.

FrayedBear Level 9 May 23, 2018

Do you understand the toxicity of the phrase - "withholding sex"?

It's deeply offensive because it infers a woman is being dishonest and playing games.

It overrides a woman's agency.

It assumes ownership over a woman's body.

It dismisses the fundamental concept of consent.

And I put this to you - if you feel unwell. If you've got the flu, if you feel tired. If you've had a bad day at work and you have a pounding headache or there are stressful events going on in your life that are getting you down.. or if you are simply not in the mood and your female partner requests sex but you decline are you 'withholding' sex?

It is toxic and I was absolutely clear that it was with the conscious aim of gaining the upper hand in the relationship. I wasn't inferring I was stating out right that it was the case where a woman was being dishonest and playing games. I also said outright if she had honest motives I would (and have) wait. I have met women who weren't very nice people. I don't use the threat of force or economic blackmail in my love relationships, and I have no problem holding partners to a similar ethical standard.Not in the mood to talk is not the same punishing with the silent treatment.

There really are women who do this. Sometimes they are really hard to spot, and they have a special talent ruining their lover's day/year/life. I am sure there are also men like this, but I don't date men, so I'd have to defer that to someone with more experience.


That's a nasty habit of grossly insecure women to use sex for control.


It's okay for some people, I guess, but I don't think on the first date is very sensible. Sharing such intimacies and vulnerabilities should come after developing a trusting relationship.

dare2dream Level 7 May 22, 2018

Sensible is not an adjective applied often to me. I would rather trust someone and be wrong than mistrust someone and be wrong, I have been burned a few times but on balance it's better to find out sooner than later. The most important thing for anyone is to live the life that's right for them and owning the consequences of their own decisions.

@Buttercup right on! Fortune favors for the bold, as you said

I really like your point of view, it's not mine and won't be but it's sane and thoughtful. I joined and promptly left the atheist Republican group because they thought restoring Israel's biblical capitol was a good idea. . I'm left of liberal, SJW and avowedly feminist but I strongly believe a fiscal conservative should be included in every government budget. "Can we afford this?" is always a legitimate question. I think,"Am I rushing into this?" in matters of romance also is always a legitimate question.


When I first met my wife she was so drunk she could barely stand, having been separated from the friend she was out with then ejected from the nightclub she was in. She then latched onto me and was keen to take me home but I declined as she was way too drunk. She had lost her housekeys (we later discovered her friend had her handbag) so I got a taxi and delivered her to the home of another of her friends. She was crashed out within minutes (booze does that apparently) so I said goodnight to her friend and left. Just as I was leaving, her friend thanked me for not "taking advantage" then asked for my number so she could call me to thank me for getting her home safe when/if she sobered up. She called me the following day and I gave her a bit of a telling off for allowing some stranger to load her into a taxi and urging her to be more careful in future. 20 years later we're still here driving each other nuts but I seriously love and adore her.

Eastrenbi Level 5 May 22, 2018

Damn... That is a sweet story


Livin' the dream

Buttercup Level 8 May 22, 2018


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