Trump creates permission structures that allow people to let their worst impulses run free. It's a really gross and perverted form of liberty, but they'll take it.

Really? That's interesting, because we didn't have to wait until the end of Trump's time in office to find out how many Trump administration officials saw him for what he is. For instance, Trump's first Secretary of State, Rex Tillerson, called Trump a "fucking moron." And Miles Taylor, Deputy Secretary of Homeland Security, anonymously delivered a scathing indictment of Trump well before Trump left office. And Trump's first National Security Advisor, Gen. James Mattis, broke with Trump publicly before the end if Trump's term. And Chairman of the Joint Chiefs, Gen. Mark Milley, denounced Trump right before the end of his term. Shall I go on?

All the family grifters at the WH.

@Flyingsaucesir A President Harris would never be accused of being a "fucking moron".

@puff Probably not, since she's smart as a whip. You saw how she demolished Trump in the debate? It's no wonder he won't debate her again. He knows he's outmatched. Hell, he won't even go on 60 Minutes, because they fact check everything.

@puff "All the family grifters at the WH." Mmm, and HOW many trumps were on the WH payroll?
Btw if Harris is such a moron? Why did Trump praise her and contribute to her campaign in 2012?

You bet a lot? How much? What, specifically, will constitute you winning the bet?

@273kelvin Grifters all round. Same as morons.

@puff Having read so many of your comments, I have to conclude that you are as constructive as an evangelical waiting for the rapture and just as logical.

@273kelvin I'm constructive. I suggest solutions, not just complain. I can't help that every single solution requires the United States to pull it's head in.
I say NATO declare it will never accept Ukranian membership. Not up to Ukraine, up to NATO. This will appease Russia thus ending conflict. Totally achievable but dare suggest and all the Russia accusations come flowing. US hubris won't allow this sensible solution.
The Biden Admin breaks the USA's own laws, like Leahy's Law and others in enabling the IDF. So just enforce your own laws is all that needs doing eg no more support for Israel diplomatically or materially. Conflict ended. Totally achievable but dare suggest and all the Trump/ antisemitic accusations come flowing. US hubris won't allow this lawful solution.
Some need to be told. Just being a mate. "Pull ya head in!"

@puff If NATO or the EU wanted Ukraine they would already be members. That said, it would now be more difficult to deny them considering Russia's aggression. One thing is certain, it is NOT up to Russia what organisation they may or may not join, do you agree?
Russia has used the same playbook as Germany did regarding the Sudatonland. How well did the appeasement you propose work out then?
It is incredibly naive to think that Israel would collapse without US support. Sure it helps but it's not the whole ballgame. That said, it does provide the leverage of an ally.
If you had your way, the US and NATO would have no allies, if fact NATO would not exist. I suggest you consider how far having such radical views would get you in somewhere like Russia. It always makes me laugh how much guys like you berate the West while enjoying its freedom. You say things like "Putin has purged the corrupt and incompetent from the armed forces and their support infrastructure." So I assume that throwing guys out of windows, murdering them and their families or organising the odd plane crash is okay in your eyes? Oh and Russia is still just as corrupt, if not more so.

@273kelvin "One thing is certain, it is NOT up to Russia what organisation they may or may not join, do you agree?".
No I do not, nor obviously does Russia. Nor does NATO if they were true to their charter.
What is NATO's charter? European security. They have known since at least 2008 that Ukraine joining NATO would cause conflict with Russia. Known 100% but NATO carried on with the expansionist plans. Russia sought a peace many times with one main demand: No NATO. Rejected. Has this policy NATO have been pursuing, to expand to the Russian border by absorbing Ukraine, increased European security? So why fucking do it?

Russia has evolved from the 1990's. The US has no allies just useful idiots. They cut and run when it advantages them and them only every single time.
Has NATO kept Europe out of conflict? No, but lets keep it anyway. Let them continue to justify their job.
You know where I have felt most free? Thailand, even when under military rule. And Laos PDR, one of the three remaining communist countries. "Western freedom" needs to compare their societies with some others and lose some of their "Western Free democracies are the only way" beliefs. Not as free as we think, especially compared to Thailand. Used to be but no more. Instead, us in the West promote genocide now, which really respects "freedom" and "democratic rule" doesn't it?
And Putin thanks the West for all the sanctions, as it has allowed him to root out corruption initiated by foreign money.

@273kelvin The only appeasement I propose is that a defense pact stop expanding. Or else tell the truth eg NATO is not a defense pact but an military alliance who seeks to expand, disregarding any opposition as an "attack on freedom".
When planned expansion causes conflict, can it be called "Defense"?

@puff Russia invaded Crimea in 2016. Nothing was done. Did that stop Russia from invading again? But letting Russia have another part of Ukraine will stop aggression now, right?
If Russia has the right to tell Ukraine who they can or cannot ally with? Does that mean that your ex-wife can tell you who to date?

@273kelvin Depends if the ex is going to insist on standing on my doorstep.
The British have been keen on the Black Sea for centuries. After MI6 and the CIA encouraged a change of government via coup in 2014. Crimea became Russian the same year, early 2014, whilst there was a power vacuum and aggression from Kyiv.
Russia has been very clear what it wants. Security guarantees, a buffer between opposing forces. A peace with an intact Ukraine minus Crimea, with no NATO presence, was rejected by Ukraine in favour of a promised NATO membership, providing a back door into the EU. "Russia is weak and can be beaten with full NATO support. Whatever it takes". Zelenskyy decided to reject peace early 2022. I relate this stary as it shows what a croc of shite it is that Russia has ever planned to take over Ukraine. Why did not NATO enforce the Minsk Agreement as supposed to? That one supported by the UNSC? If that was done, no war. NATO were too busy building CIA stations and biolabs instead. Building up the Ukranian military so it may confront Russia.. Minsk was just buying time. You may check all I have said here.

@273kelvin He's so pro-Putin, so anti-West, I suspect @puff may be a paid stooge of the Kremlin. Ever notice how the biggest boosters of authoritarianism/Putin/Russia on this site all claim to be from Australia? I have yet to see a single Putin fan here who admits he's Russian. Not one! I've been here since 2018.

@Flyingsaucesir You were too late mate, the site was far better pre-Trump. I think perhaps living in Thailand but especially working in Laos helped formed my views. Something to do with having to clear UXO before I could do any work and meeting people without limbs in Laos I suppose.
But I really turned after Libya or more correctly, NATO's destruction of that country. A good mate of mine had worked there extensively and was quite upset when that nation was destroyed. Another good mate in merchant shipping was also quite upset over Yemen and the Saudi/ US destruction of that country too. Same old story eg after a free election where the locals made the wrong choice so get invaded/ overthrown by the US.
Look at Russia pre-Putin and now. He has been a good leader for Russia. To deny this is denying reality. Living in SE Asia also made me realise that our shit in the West actually stinks the same as well. Nowhere near as good as we think we are in our superior Anglo-Saxon based societies.

@Flyingsaucesir Perhaps American expats also helped form my views of arrogant/ loud and self entitled Americans too. I did find the ones who had travelled previously were far better in their self centered world view. Because they understood the USA was not the indispensable exceptional nation they are taught at school. Think it happens to all expats eg I am nowhere near as nationalistic as I was when I first went o/s. Glad I became a world citizen. I like variety. Don't like fascism which "The West" has become.

@Flyingsaucesir To make you feel better, many of my peers, Australians, are also very insular and redneck. Our media here is so flooded with American news only they have succumbed to the repetitive messaging. I view my news from many places. A prime example is the current hurricane which sounds extremely severe and I hope none here are facing devastation. But that's it; USA. So the way my mind works, knowing Florida and other gulf states share that same body of water with other nations, I look at how other countries are faring. Not reported in our Western English media, like they don't exist. Australians don't care unless the US tells us to. So don't think I hate Americans as such, people are people. I don't like what America has become on the international stage for sure. But if I hate anything it would be how subservient my country is to everything USA. How authoritarian authority has become. I left Australia 2002, returning 2019. In 2002 we used to laugh at American flag waving patriots chanting "USA USA USA". Totally apathetic.
In 2019 all of a sudden we celebrate Halloween which we never did, have permanent US forces on our soil which we never did, and news is saturated with US narrative. Our politicians debate on who sucks up the best to US interests as their main selling point. As mentioned saw the affects of a war 50 years ago by dealing with cluster bombs and large unexploded aircraft bombs.
I hope this helps you understand why I don't stand in awe of US rules based world order. I do want my country to break free from US influence which will occur when US has some changes.
I do not find being accused of being Russian an insult at all. I have no problem with Russian people and see their military aggression for what it is, a response. Taking a stand and pushing back at the US rules based order which at this moment, enables genocide.
If you really want to insult me, call me an Israeli. But don't dare call me a Kiwi

I believe Kamala Harris does care about us, the common people. Her whole record of public service supports this conclusion.

Trump, on the other hand, has demonstrated over and over that he doesn't give a sh*t about anyone but himself.

Olbermann did not intend for that 5% number to be taken as a statistic. It's only a tongue-in-cheek device, created to help shed light on a very dark mystery: why there are still so many people who will vote for Trump, in spite of his open racism, xenophobia, misogyny, incompetence, self interest, criminality, and fascist tendencies.

@Flyingsaucesir Do you think it possible that any Trump "supporters" have none of the flaws you mention?
How did Biden win? Exactly how Trump will win, by not being the other.
Trump will win because the Biden/ Harris admin has been so bad. If they were a good admin, there would be no chance of Trump winning. This is the truth the Democratic Party will never accept. It will be someone else's fault as always.

@puff By any measure, the Biden/Harris administration has been a spectacular success. They shepherded us through a global pandemic, and their policies allowed the USA to bounce back faster than any other country, big or small. They did what many thought could not be done, i.e. achieve a "soft landing" for the post-pandemic economy. Pandemic-related supply chain issues and Putin's illegal war in Ukraine sparked high inflation, and the Biden/Harris administration got inflation down faster and farther than in any other country. And their policies led to the creation of more American jobs than any administration in history. They brought back manufacturing that had long since left for foreign shores. And they have largely cleaned up the mess that Trump left after he alienated our allies and cozied up to foreign dictators.

Not for nothing was Trump impeached twice, indicted by five (5) grand juries, convicted of 34 felonies, banned from doing business in the state of New York, fined nearly half a billion dollars, found liable for defamation, and adjudicated a rapist. The mother fucker is a walking disaster, a serial liar, a racist, a misogynist, a xenophobe, and, above all, a nit wit. He bumbled the response to the pandemic, undercutting the health professionals on everything from reasonable measures like wearing masks and getting vaccinated, to suggesting taking household cleaners internally. What an incompetent dumbass! Now he wants to impose up to 20% taxes on all imported goods, falsely telling Americans that foreign countries like China will pay those tariffs. Well that's not how tariffs work. It would be Americans who would pay those taxes. Do you want to pay 20% more for every imported good you buy? Economists agree that Trump's plan would crash the economy badly. Jesus!

@Flyingsaucesir "By any measure, the Biden/Harris administration has been a spectacular success". I would love to see what a failure looks like. Amazing Biden was only judged as the 14th best president really, should have been higher. The USA had the worse death rate in the world during covid. Trump defended consent needed for all medical treatment, so do I.
Tariffs are just sanctions in another form, a weaponisation of currency. The idea is to make locally made products competitive with cheaper o/s ones. Can benefit locally made products, but with the $USD situation, just another nail in the coffin.
Nothing and no-one can save the $USD and it's the fault of decades of US policy, of which 12 of the last 16 years has been democratic with Biden a central figure.

"And they have largely cleaned up the mess that Trump left after he alienated our allies and cozied up to foreign dictators.".
Are you for real here? Blind support of Israel has alienated many allies. The Biden/ Harris admin cozies up with a former president with no constitutional authority in Zelenskyy, and a genocidal maniac in Netanyahu.
Glass houses. Regarding Israel, the US is their bitch, bought and paid for, whoever is potus.

@puff Now that is a good question! There probably are Trump supporters with none of the defects listed by Olbermann. But they would necessarily have other defects, such as poor critical thinking skills, or rank tribalism that puts ideological conformity above fealty to truth, or being hopelessly uninformed.

The thing is, Trump is a con artist who uses his gift for showmanship to draw people in. Some people think he's funny. To others he gives licence to be their worst selves. He knows that if you tell a lie enough times, people begin to believe it. And he's shrewd enough to keep embellishing it, upping the ante, so his schtick doesn't go stale. People who are not well versed in history, especially the history if fascism, are not aware of what they are seeing and hearing. But everything Trump does is right out of the fascist playbook: scapegoating immigrants; casting aspersions on intellectuals; villifying the free press; falsely saying the electoral system is rigged; claiming "I alone can fix it." There is nothing new or original about Trump. He stole his act from Mussolini.

@Flyingsaucesir Trump is Trump and what you describe is a text book psychopath eg Charismatic, vain, good at manipulating people, totally self absorbed and never wrong. He reads and acts in the moment well. It is a cult of personality that has built around him.
But as far as fascism/ dictatorial government goes, that is already exemplified by the Democratic party in the present. So if/ when Trump gets in, he won't create a fascist society, he will inherit one. His vanity wants his place in history so he will be a bull elephant in a crystal shop, or try to be.

I'm a foreigner so the thing for me is what the USA represents now and has since the Patriot Act was introduced is too destructive. affecting too many others in this world negatively. Yes the US has always interfered with others with coups and assassinations etc but at least that was done in secret with a moral public persona. There is no shame at all now,no attempt to hide, just moving from one nation to the next in the constant war machine the Patriot Act enables. So I'm of the opinion the crystal shop sucks so send the bull in. I don't care if the bull is red or blue, just needs a bull. The established Republican and Democratic parties will never do it, so an outsider/ independent will be needed.

The Sanders campaign inspired for the same reason Trump did and does again now eg promising to change the status quo. Yes Trump's a con man, unpredictable, so will he actually do anything useful? Open to argument but sure as shit, neither of the established party ensemble will change things, definitely not the Democratic Party that loves the status quo and keep chipping away at the US Constitution and Bill of Rights (establishment GOP the same eg Dick Chenny, Pompeo, Bolton etc. Not picking on any party just these establishment professional politicians of all shades)..

The best thing any POTUS can do is rip up the Patriot Act, which has outlived its "war on terror". This will rid your country of agencies like Homeland Security and force the surveillance state, enshrouded in secrecy, to be dismantled. Future generations of Americans will thank you. So will the rest of the world.

@puff I have never been a fan of the Patriot Act, so we have some common ground there. But the rest of what you wrote is mostly,...how best to describe it?... rot, noise, idiot wind....? So you'd like to burn down the USA and start from scratch, huh? I have a better idea. I hear there are ants in your cellar. So why don't you burn down your house? Have you always been such a tosser? Wow. You can go now. Close the door behind you.

@Flyingsaucesir How it goes down is up to Americans, I just encourage it to change as the status quo is not working. Radical change is needed so things will be broken, but not the whole lot. You have an instruction manual already called the Constitution. So enforce that for starters eg the 1st Amendment is sacred. To do this, the Patriot Act must go. Secondly, enforce all current laws equally. Thirdly, audit alphabet agencies and the Pentagon eg CIA, DHS, DoD, FBI etc. Make them accountable.
Most importantly, accept the USA is no longer top dog on prison Earth. A multipolar world is emerging. Start preparing for status loss of the $USD. US debt is becoming unserviceable.

I have a feeling that we are in a period of flux like WW I. Borders are going to be redrawn in the ME and Europe/ Ukraine. The Australian Federation may well break up, with certain states breaking away. Perhaps the Russian Federation also breaks up. Perhaps the American Republic will lead the way in this trend for one last time. Lots of smaller entities appeals more than one large one for me so come on BRICS!

Won't happen again. I hope not. If Donald Stump gets back in the White House he will undo everything that I have know and become accustomed to in my lifetime. He is not a leader. He is a destroyer.

@DenoPenno That's the whole thing. The American Republic is what has become destructive and psychopathic eg the USA enables genocide in 2024 by both arming fascists and protecting them diplomatically.
The USA has changed greatly in my lifetime as well. It has gone from a beacon of light on the hill to a destructive nation which no longer inspires. Somethings gotta change and it seems the tool to implement that change is called Trump.

Putin's Russia was getting its ass kicked, and has only recently managed to pull off a stalemate. And that very UN-impressive feat of arms was only achieved because the USA and our European allies have been woefully slow to deliver supplies to Ukraine, and have placed heavy restrictions on how and where Ukraine can use what weapons they have received. With one hand tied behind her back, Ukraine has stalled an opponent ten times her size!

It's no wonder that hundreds of thousands of Russian men of military age have fled the country. They don't want to fight on the wrong side of an illegal, immoral, and ill-conceived war, and they especially don't want to die in Putin's Ukraine meat grinder.

The Russian economy is already teetering on the brink of collapse. Inflation is eating up the Ruble. In an effort to stop the bleeding, the Russian central bank has raised interest rates to nearly 28%. Even with the massive exodus of draft avoiders, people can't find housing. The average Russian earns less than the average Indian.

Unfortunately, this will go on for a while longer, and things will get worse for Russians and Ukrainians alike. It's such a shame; it didn't have to be this way. Putin didn't have to invade the sovereign territory of its neighbor. But Putin had committed similar atrocities elsewhere and gotten away with it. This time, however, he has bitten off more than he can chew. It will be his undoing. The West is committed to supporting Ukraine for the long haul. We cannot simply stand by and let a cheap thug snatch sovereign territory from a European country and nascent democracy.. Especially not one that is as rich in agricultural resources and essential minerals as Ukraine is.

Donald Trump is going to lose the 2024 election, just like he lost in 2018, 2020, 2022. It's going to be close, but he will lose (again).

@Flyingsaucesir You are badly underestimating the "enemy" here. There is no stalemate now, Russia gains ground every day.
This is a war of attrition eg see who runs out of bullets first. Russia is happy to take it's time in this as it achieves one of their stated aims: To de-militarise Ukraine, they are just doing it the hard way. A major difference between NATO and other militaries is they don't work to a time line but react to realities on the ground eg If the Afghanistan withdrawal by Biden was not planned to coincide with the 9/11 anniversary it would have been very different and more professional.
All your arguments above, why not apply the same morals/ principals to Israel/ Palestine and now Lebanon? This is why American homogony is waning fast. The whole world see's the hypocrisy in US foreign policy.
I'm afraid many in "the West" are in for a very rude awakening very shortly.

@Flyingsaucesir Never, ever forget who destroyed Libya, the most prosperous nation in Africa. Wasn't Russia nor China. Hamas or Hezbollah. Wasn't Iran or Syria either. Who then?

It was NATO, mainly the French and the US, "defending" Europe that time........allegedly. Against what threat?
Oxymoronic NATO, that defense pact constantly expanding and engaging in expeditionary conflicts. NATO who bombed Yugoslavia ignoring the UN, now with their biggest European base in Bosnia.

@puff Oh, you think this all came about in 2024. Jesus! The changes that Traitor Trump will bring about will disrupt a great many of our lifestyles. Donald trump is a disgrace to us all and a sorry human being. Maybe I should run down your country a while and tell you who your leader should be.

@puff Moamar Gaddafi was a tyrant and murderer, and was directly responsible for the bombing of a commercial jet liner over Lockerbie, Scotland. There was already open rebellion against his regime before NATO got involved (in a very limited way).

NATO stopped an ongoing genocide in what was once called Yugoslavia. The atrocities were perpetrated mostly by Christian Serbs against their Moslem neighbors. It was a good day's work on NATO's part.

@DenoPenno Please feel free re Australian politics but you won't see me defending our government/ opposition too much . I agree with what you say. Trump is a disgrace but the reality is so is the behaviour of those in power. Nothing to be proud of either side.
Blinken lies in negotiation and has lied to Congress. He is the foreign face of the USA. "Disgrace" is an appropriate word for this Biden/ Harris representative.

@Flyingsaucesir Libya had nothing to do with European security. Legally eg NATO's own charter, there was zero justification for NATO intervention. Zip. Nadda. This means "None of anyone else's business how sovereign nations govern".
NATO a "Defense pact" my arse. Open slave markets and mass migration to Europe. The brilliance of NATO overreaching their own charter defending what? Defending against upstart nations becoming prosperous is all I can tell.

"It was a good day's work on NATO's part."
Yeah, taking out barracks housing civilian police was a great job. As was bombing the Chinese embassy with those "precision" weapons. As was setting the precedent for undermining UN authority by carrying on regardless.

@Flyingsaucesir Puff's name starts with a "P", I think his given names should begin with P. H.---- for Prune Head. Maybe he would like to be one of Dump's most laurelled execs. You would be one of his honoured staffers--- for a few months; then you would be one of the world's stupidest bastards. And he has said that he will imprison or murder anyone who has impeded Mr. Dump.

@Diogenes Trump's psycho, a very successful one outside of government. Independant wealth not "acquired" during time in public office. Washington is full of psycho's, whose career is government and wealth obtained through their "work"..
It will take a psycho to take on other psycho's. It is a domestic problem but does influence world affairs.
The best case scenario is that all psycho's take each other out and an enema of Washington occurs. Won't be a pretty sight, but will have long term benefits.

@puff Trump's "very successful," huh? I guess, if you call 8 bankruptcies, half a billion dollars in civil penalties, 5 criminal indictments, and 34 felony convictions "successful." In fact, the only thing Trump ever legitimately made money at was playing the role of a successful business man on TV. He's so "successful" that he's been banned from actually doing business in his home state.. But you go on drinking that Kool-Aid.