Agnostic.com
7 17

A few memes about something I'm finding is really important in all my relationships.

OpposingOpposum 9 July 17
Share
You must be a member of this group before commenting. Join Group

Enjoy being online again!

Welcome to the community of good people who base their values on evidence and appreciate civil discourse - the social network you will enjoy.

Create your free account

7 comments

Feel free to reply to any comment by clicking the "Reply" button.

1

Love these!

BeeHappy Level 9 July 23, 2018
1

Always a work in progress!

GreatNani Level 8 July 19, 2018
1

Very good!! I like the last one best,

0

I have mixed feelings about this. While I agree that boundaries are important, they are not the end of the story. I think modern discourse is so concerned with individualistic values that the further step of development know as interdependence is neglected.

I see a developmental arc from dependence (childhood), to independence (young adulthood), to interdependence (family & community). That arc is interrupted with co-dependence in pathological cases like when a family member is addicted, mentally ill, or chronically ill. Then the normal obligations of family life become unreasonable demands that are abusive and harmful. People in recovery from those situations need to learn to get back to independence before they can level up to the next step and take on interdependence again.

But let's not forget the goal is interdependence, and that healthy family and community are bound, in part, by things like: positive obligations; taking SOME responsibility to make others happy; sometimes sacrificing your own satisfaction in order to take care of someone who legitimately needs you; trying to be polite and not step on others toes; etc.

If we all become expert at merely being independent, we lose some of the most valuable aspects of our humanity and become isolated islands of loneliness instead.

ejbman Level 7 July 17, 2018

I disagree. Boundaries are not about being completely independent of others. They are about making demanding respect, particularly for those who do a lot for others. When someone gives and gives and it becomes expected and the givers needs aren't being met or even considered that is an unacceptable situation. Women are particularly bad about this. We frequently make a life centered around meeting everyone else's needs. When the kids grow up or our husbands decide we're boring because all we ever talk about is family/kid stuff, we're floored. It happens because we forget to nurture ourselves. People take givers for granted and walk all over them. Boundaries are about retaining our individuality. Not becoming useful lil' stepford wives(or husbands) and demanding the same respect and consideration we show others.

@Blindbird I think we're actually in agreement but there is a misunderstanding. Perhaps I neglected to add to the list of pathological factors which promote co-dependence. Under the general heading of systemic factors would be: patriarchal power structures, racial power structures, class power structures, and any other related factors that promote exactly what you describe. I agree completely that there are people in our society who are over-demanded upon, and are thereby abused. Such folks are not only pressured from outside themselves, but have internalized the demand imposed by an entire society's values. I agree that requires correction.

And as I said at the top of my comment as a disclaimer "I agree that boundaries are important" - I mean that, and I affirm it throughout the developmental arc. Even during childhood dependence, our boundaries are important, and we should respect our children's wishes, physical integrity, developmental capabilities and so on. Even when we engage the interdependence of family and community, we need to take care of ourselves and not overextend to the point of chronic exhaustion or abuse of self.

I hope I'm not coming across as mansplaining. That is not my intent at all. I absolutely affirm your point about the value of self-care, and about leveling the field in families and societies, especially around gender, race, and so on. There are lots of people, mostly white males, that get away with doing too little at the expense of others. That needs correction.

Even so, I don't want to ignore the fact that we as human beings are ultimately built for connection, and that connection is messier than platitudes about boundaries can capture. I remain concerned about throwing the baby out with bathwater, so to speak, and ignoring the part of "self care" which involves deep and intimate connection with others. Those connections do not neatly fall into the lists of boundaries.

@ejbman. I don't entirely disagree but the phrase "stuffed shirt" comes to mind.

@Blindbird OK, as long as it's not "asshole", I'll take it 😉

@ejbman eh not today.

1

Very good advise..Indeed

EvaV Level 7 July 17, 2018
2

This is really great stuff. Thank you.

MFAtheist Level 7 July 17, 2018
2

Brene Brown is the SHIT!

Squirrel Level 7 July 17, 2018
Write Comment

Recent Visitors 88

Photos 163 More

Posted by AtheistPeace666Hello I'm a single Canuck looking for my special lady Canuck.

Posted by KhaCRYou ever feel like you found the perfect sexual partner then he turns out to be a complete 💩bag and you can’t find the satisfaction in other encounters?

Posted by EntheogenFanI have a story to tell.

Posted by EntheogenFanI have a story to tell.

Posted by KateOahuYes, I agree that the reverse is also true.

Posted by JolantaThis is what women have to put up with and then they want to be intimate while we are still angry because they will not do their share of housework.

Posted by JolantaDucky, Snookums....

Posted by SorchaThis is a guy I was talking to from okcupid. He is totally new to online dating and it shows.

Posted by JolantaThat’s Amore. Some women are just far too shallow.

Posted by JolantaSomething for real intimacy perhaps.

Posted by Green_Soldier71Has anyone here had any experience with (or known someone who has/had) a SEXLESS MARRIAGE/RELATIONSHIP or a FRIGID PARTNER?

Posted by EyesThatSmileNakedness.

Posted by LetzGetRealMy family has often commented how I should become a "cougar"... as I look pretty good at my age and have a younger mindset than some of my peers, I guess this is there rationale?

Posted by Ann-1980The 4 types of Intimacy to feel sufficient, satisfied & healing in a love relationship.

Posted by Philip21over the top thinking? [agnostic.com]

Posted by DavidRussettI have been a widower for 2 years. I am very lonely. I am really looking for a relationship wth someone compatible with me.

  • Top tags#relationship #sex #intimacy #video #friends #religious #hope #religion #world #god #children #wife #marriage #book #kids #advice #death #reason #agnostic #beliefs #Atheist #hell #money #society #movies #fear #hello #Present #parents #belief #loves #Song #community #lonely #books #divorce #culture #humans #dogs #sleep #chemistry #Christian #college #soul #animals #sexy #philosophy #holiday #DonaldTrump #sexuality ...

    Members 1,849Top

    Moderator