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Too many atheists are hostile to the religious. I understand the animosity but I don't think it is deserved.

Chickenwing 5 May 23
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79 comments

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16

You bet your ass l am hostile. I could give a rat's ass what anyone believes, but when you start pushing your bullshit agenda into our laws and societal behavior you have crossed a line where l will most definitely get hostile. 😠 See!😊

I agree with this. I work for a religious healthcare institution that is trying its best to do what it can during this pandemic whilst having to ration out PPEs to everyone in the hospital. It's really scary for me, especially since I have to scan COVID infected patients for 20 minutes at a time, for the shortest exam that I have to perform. It's really scary. Anyway, they know I'm not religious, a non-believer, and I'm still employed. Never once have they tried to convert me, and I'm not out of work while most everyong in the country now is.

My employers have walked the walk most religious folks talk about and everyday I've seen them trying hard to help. But I have also seen other organizations that are busy using the tools of government & this pandemic to advance their religious agenda in the hopes to force their way of life on everyone. Those people I am hostile to, 'cuz I've seen the damage they do to others, to society, to everything not bowing to their god. "Hostility" is good where it is called for, but it should be used with restraint, not just on everyone of the religious just because they are religious. It's more effective that way and less exhausting.

@Radu Why would l care if a nonbeliever runs for office. Laws based on WOO are ridiculous and dangerous or do you not pay attention to history? What you said makes no sense.

@Georgy303 I have known a handful of believers who walk the walk and don't try to push their beliefs on others. I have no problem with those folks.

16

Many of us are hostile to religions. The religious we take on a case by case basis.

YES!

15

All my friends are religious, I’m not in the least hostile to them. I think you are mistaken in thinking that animosity towards the doctrine, which the religious believe as true, is hostility towards the person. I think it’s fair game to decry and attack the institutions and the hierarchy of the churches in the same way that they attack the secular and try to portray those who don’t believe their creed as immoral and dangerous. I personally don’t care what individuals believe or where they worship, as long as they allow me the same courtesy to not believe or worship. Problems only arise, when this philosophy of mine is challenged by someone who tells me I’m wrong to not believe in god because I should, then it becomes personal and I push back.

14

If an atheist is hostile towards religion, then most likely they were raised in a religion that did a lot fo psychological damage.

You don't have to be Psychologically damaged to be hostile to religion. Supporting human rights, women's rights, gay rights and critical thinking is enough to make you hostile to religion.

@dermot235 The posting I answered right before my response had to do with the burning of a Mississippi church, where someone used graffiti to try to blame it on atheists. So, my mindset was in terms of considering hostility as acts of violence or destruction. I do think that persons who are hostile to the point of committing acts of destruction or violence were most very likely psychologically damaged by religion.

You are right. A person can be hostile towards religion without psychological damage, and hostility does not always mean acts of violence and destruction as was my mind set when I responded.

Put a shirt on.

14

It doesn't take much research of religious history to realise that animosity IS well deserved. Pedophiles, witch burning, the inquisition etc. Although one might argue that is history, a study of current events shows the continuing impact of their bigotry even if it is not as blatant or as overt as it was. And when you say religion in general, let's not forget genital mutilations, child brides, honour killing etc.

And even in western nations like USA you have conversion therapy and conversion camps for LGTB+ youth, reproductive rights being slowly eroded, etc.

And the Boy Scouts. They threw me out. Assholes.

@PondartIncbendog Consider yourself lucky.

12

Many atheists are hostile to religion and that is apparent, but have you any data to indicate that atheists go around exhibiting hostility toward the religious (which is different)? I recently read a bunch of responses christians gave when asked what they thought of atheists. They all suggested violence against atheists: hang them, shoot them, beat them up, etc. I have not seen atheists saying these things about religious people.

g

12

So those who systematically terrify children into compliance by saying that if they don't believe, they will burn forever in the fire-pits of hell don't deserve animosity?

So those who systematically undermine scientific discovery and advancement because it doesn't comply with the tennets of their faith don't deserve animosity?

So those who justify their own howling bigotry and intollerance by quoting from a book of middle-eastern, bronze-age fairy-tales, written by goat-herders who didn't even know the Earth orbitted the Sun don't deserve animosity?

So those who seek to base the laws of the land on their own, religious text, thus forcing it on others who do not accept said text don't deserve animosity?

So those who have a history of savage torture and abuse (such as the Spanish Inquisition, the slaughter and subjugation of native American peoples) and genocidal war (for example the Crusades) don't deserve animosity?

Sorry - you are mistaken.

Animosity is EXACTLY what religion deserves.

12

There were many religious folk who were "hostile" toward me, when I was peacefully coming to terms with my agnosticism. They were so hateful and spiteful, arrogant and deceitful, that they deserved far more animosity than I gave them by withdrawing myself from their life, but I prefer a peaceful ending.

I also have gentle religious folk in my life, who give respect and even express comaraderie with me, knowing we are both passionate in our different beliefs yet also good people, so whatever we are doing is right for us. I'm happy to be their friend, because they don't try to tell me I'm wrong, they're right, and I'm going to hell, unless I let them save me with their myth.

Anyone wanting to mess with me with their hostility regarding my beliefs needs to allow me to walk away from them, or I will get hostile right back, which is not my preference. Yes, they deserve animosity if they are imposing their myth on me. I've done a lot of thinking on the subject, to get where I am in my beliefs. I've likely done far more reading on religions than they have too, so they are wise not to pick a fight with me. It's just not worth it. Lucky for me, I can live in a bubble without too many people showing me animosity. πŸ™‚

11

It's not just hostility towards the religious.

Many Atheists are just hostile in general... even towards its own kind.

I have to conclude that some people are just aΓ—Γ—holes.

And there are plenty here

You reckon?
Most Atheists I know and the vast majority of the ones here would 'literally 'give the shirt off of their back to someone in genuine need, I know I would and have done so many a time as well, so IF that makes us arse-holes then so be it and sue us for it as well.

@SleeplessInTexas

You sound bitter and jaded. I disagree. Atheists I have met and who are members of this website are intelligent, kind, funny and thoughtful.

Since 2006, I have volunteered as a college mentor at Wenatchee High School. I help low income, first generation (children of immigrants) write essays for college and scholarship applications.

One of my best success stories is Brenda, who won $269,445 in scholarships in 2016. A junior at Wesleyan University, Brenda plans to become a medical doctor and pathologist. She hopes to cure diseases.

Photos:

  1. In 2018, I took three young women I previously mentored on a day hike at Icicle Gorge. From left:

Tammy, a Vietnamese immigrant, is studying to become a neurosurgeon at the Univ. of Washington.

Me.

Brenda, the oldest child of Mexican immigrants, is becoming a pediatrician.

Teresa, the oldest child of Mexican immigrants, is an accountant and Latinx community organizer. Recently Teresa and her brother, also an accountant, bought a house for their parents.

  1. I'm a rockstar! First Scholarship Rockstar award, 2018.

  2. Another award from Wenatchee High School, 2019.

@LiterateHiker
Your assumption is VERY WRONG.

Your response is an example: assuming I was "jaded."

I have personal messages from at least 7 Atheists who used to be members or used to interact daily on this site, (myself included) who get disrespected by other Atheists for not thinking like some of you RADICAL Atheists do.

I have become personal friends with Atheists from this site who no longer frequent it or are no longer members. They shared their experiences about some of their treatment from members on this site.

Mainly bad treatment from the members that live their life on this site or have an internet addiction.

It took me a long time to get to L8, but that's because I actually have a job, family, and a life.

I travel and I'm also not addicted to social media or status level on this site.

For those addicted to your social media or this site:

I recommend getting out and enjoying life. It might make a lot of the radical Atheists on this site more humble.

There are very nice and respectful Atheists on this site. Very few of you are on my list. I'm THAT picky.

@LiterateHiker
Btw.. you are one of the few Atheists I respect on this site.

You are authentic and raw.

Thank you.

@SleeplessInTexas

Thank you. I appreciate your kind words.

Kathleen

@SleeplessInTexas

I said you sound jaded, not "are jaded". Words are important.

In my 20s, I learned to criticize behavior, not attack someone personally.

It became a lifelong habit.

@SleeplessInTexas Everything you said is correct .I have been assaulted with Obscenities on numerous occasions just for voicing my opinions here .The word RADICAL is a perfect assessment of many of the people on this site .

11

Religion does not deserve hostility, oh really? As Bill Mahr once said," When I hear from people that religion doesn't hurt anything I say really? Well besides wars, the crusades, the inquisitions, 9-11, ethnic cleansing, the suppression of women, the suppression of homosexuals, fatwas, honor killings, suicide bombings, arranged marriages to minors, human sacrafice, burning witches, and systematic sex with children, I have a few little quibbles. And I forgot blowing up a girls school in Afghanistan."

10

I don't see how expressing an opinion is hostile. Atheists don't go around blowing up clinics, hanging and burning believers, or forcing believers to convert to anything. We have a right to get together as we do on this site, and vent and express our opinions on religions that have been oppressing the populus for centuries. So freedom of speech is only afforded to the theists, but when nonbelievers express their opinions and exercise their freedom of speech it is considered hostile. I don't see it that way.

10

That's quite a broad statement. Can't speak for anyone else but I certainly don't go around attacking religious people. As far as I am concerned people are free to engage in whatever they wish, as long as they do not interfere with my rights. If anything I find myself on the defense. On a larger level I do have concerns about my country being run by people who use religion for political gain and those who might wish to impose faith based laws.

10

A majority of the times I have observed hostility being projected at the religious, it has been BY the religious
A majority of the times I have observed hostility being projected at the atheistic, it has been BY the religious
The majority of the times I have observed "hostility" or as I would call it just criticism, being projected at the religious, BY the atheistic it has not been because they ARE religious, it has been because they are arrogant, willfully ignorant, cruel and unjust, plain ignorant, down right stupid, exploitative, crooked, perverted or are protecting the exploitative, crooked and perverted for no other reason than that the are religious.
In such cases it is perfectly reasonable to feel such criticism is well deserved.

It's hard to argue those points but you just know that some religious type with a persecution complex will give it a go. lol Maybe Atheists should apologize for all of the centuries of persecutions, inquisitions and the occasional burning at the stake of religious types, that we are so famous for throughout history. (that was a bit of sarcasm, just in case a religious troll decided to try an use it as a basis for their argument) πŸ˜‰

@Surfpirate - What I find interesting is the number of religious willing not to excuse the action and misdeeds of believers, but their willingness to disown them. I've been told numerous times that the "persecutions, inquisitions and the occasional burning at the stake [by] religious types" disqualifies those perpetrators as being Christian. Never mind that the source of justification for the behaviors is the same inerrant religious texts they claim as perfect and God given, and never mind that their God allowed them to misuse - as they claim - this inerrant text to perpetrate atrocities. So, not only are nonbelievers misattributed with these misdeeds, we have those religious perpetrators posthumously "excommunicated" from the religion they were devoted to lumped in with them.

@RussRAB Such behaviour is known as the "No true Scotsman" logical fallacy, a form of circular argument, based on the addition of ad hoc "presuppositions" after the fact.
eg
Premise: All Scotsmen eat porridge
Counter argument: Some Scotsmen do not eat porridge
Fallacy: By not eating porridge they prove themselves to not be "true scotsmen" and are therefore do not invalidate the original premise.

@LenHazell53 - Thanks for the explanation. I had heard others refer to the "no true Scotsmam" fallacy but had not read where it was explained.

10

So the pastors in the USA who have ignored the lockdown rules during the current pandemic and consequently have caused the deaths of many including themselves in several cases do not deserve ridicule.?

Your point is very well put.

There is also the stranglehold that the Catholic Church had on Australia for decades and the consequent wrecking of thousands of children's lives: [en.wikipedia.org] . Let us also not forget what it did in the Republic of Ireland: [irishexaminer.com] .

@anglophone I watched a documentary on the Boom Town Rats last night on BBC tv and a couple of historians were crediting them with helping to change the cultural attitudes in Ireland in addition to producing some great rock/pop music.
In the '70's the Roman Catholic church still had a iron grip on the populace but today things are quite different.
I would suggest thet joining the EEC and the consequent raising of living standards had more of an influence but it's all interesting stuff.

Christians have been causing deaths for over a thousand years in the name of their god. No sympathy here.

The participants have to take responsibility here too.

BTW, only the crap makes the news. It is not widespread.

@itsmedammit Maybe not widespread but it has happened on more than one occasion. I did see the figure of ten pastors dying but that may be an exaggeration. The fact that Trump is now pushing for all churches to reopen is a bit worrying.

@Moravian It is just his attempt to bolster his fans. But my comment about the news carrying only the more sensational stuff should not be surprised but I think people being people can forget that. From some comments on here I can tell that those outside of the US (and those inside too) are getting a distorted view. I read news from other countries but would never think I really have any idea of how life anywhere else is. I don't even know what it is like in other parts of the country, except in very vague terms.

@itsmedammit Maybe , but we get video clips of Trump's latest ramblings every day on BBC news so we have a good grasp of what's happening stateside. Whether we can believe what he is saying is another matter. as they say "how do you know Trump is lying ?. His lips moved.

9

Why don't you explain why it's not deserved? What do you mean by "too many"? What would be the correct amount of atheists and under what circumstance? I don't understand the point of coming here to complain about atheists without a shred of justification for your comment.

9

Oh yes! But sacred cows make the best hamburger!

@Kojaksmom Good answer but please prove it.

sacred cows...one of my favorite phrases...

to the veggie only crowd...excuse me

Cows are sacred to many in India...
people will walk by these animals, will let them roam into places they shouldnt be, because they are sacred. People are so functionally fixed they can be struggling with famine condition, extremely hungry if not outright starving and just keep on letting them walk on by...
πŸ™„πŸ€”

9

β€˜Too many religionists are hostile to atheists. I understand the animosity but I don't think it is deserved.’

Varn Level 8 May 24, 2020
9

i'm hostile when religion insinuates itself into government policy. But not to the people themselves, victims of indoctrination. We will not win them over with hostility

How about gentle mockery? Pleezzee?

(No, I'm not entirely an a-hole. I think fondly of those who gently mocked my former religion. They allowed me to see past the anger when I deconverted.)

9

I disagree. As an atheist I am supportive the religious under some conditions. I am also hostile under other conditions. I make a sharp distinction between those who seek to understand and improve their own lives, and those who try to ram their own opinions down my throat. The latter group traumatised me, and I see no good reason why they should be allowed to traumatise other people.

8

mind you, I can understand the hostility of those victims of childhood abuse at the hands of the 'godly'. They have every right to be hostile toward people who continue to support these institutions.

Thank you for saying that. I speak as a victim of the (un)Godly.

Postscript: I have just remembered that the God of the Bible is a genocidal maniac with catastrophic anger management issues. Yes, I was a victim of the Godly.

8

That is your opinion, not a fact. Most nonbelievers could not care less about religious people as long as they don't bother us. Unfortunately most religious people are required to proselytize as part of their brainwashing and that is when shit hits the fan.

8

I am against all violence. And yes, that includes the hate and bigotry that stems from religion.

7

Religion is hostile toward science, reality, and even common sense, it is inevitable that it will provoke hostility against itself, especially, when it is pushing its nonsense on others while lying and using every devious macanation it can find.

7

So if a religious person wants to ban the right of a woman to choose or wants to say that female genital mutilation is gods will or wants to justify circumcision (genital mutilation of the male) or Sharia law or enforce the education of religious beliefs in our public schools and so on and so on.....should we not be hostile to this???? Being hostile to an individual is not productive but being hostile to their beliefs is appropriate in my view. The problem with a lot of very religious people is that they take a critical view of their beliefs as a personal insult, which it is not, and they don't afford a non believer the respect that they demand.

7

I tend to exclude people from my life who are ignorant, boorish, rude, bigoted and hateful - how much of a coincidence is it that many of these kinds of people find a home in religion? I have friends who are religious but thankfully not devoutly religious to the point that it impairs their ability to reason.
I am also of the considered opinion that religion has not only been the root cause of many of the worst of our social ills but that it has also stunted our growth as a species but I don't run around burning down churches and I don't discriminate against religious people in the workplace (something that is not always true of the religious).
Do I mollycoddle the religious idiots of the world, no I do not and nor should I.

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